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#1 2019-07-26 03:31:19

linux_user
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Registered: 2016-11-04
Posts: 418

What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

I like easy computer interaction; part of the reason why  my work is done using more of the keyboard and less of the mouse.

Until lately I have been executing Atl+Tab using my thumb (on Alt) and index finger (on Tab). This demands a larger movement of my left palm from it's default position (index finger on F key). Lately I figured it out that using the thumb (on Alt) and pinky finger (on tab) will not demand so much  movement of my palm on the keyboard.

On the other hand I do not see any better key-finger pairing for Ctrl+Tab. I have considered pinky (on ctrl) and ring/middle finger (on tab); right pinky (on right Ctrl) and left pinky (on tab) as well; but it doesn't seem to quite fit in the easiness of typing. Perhaps it needs time.

What fingers do you use to execute Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

Last edited by linux_user (2019-07-26 04:59:32)


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#2 2019-07-26 06:24:04

twoion
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

Alt+Tab: left thumb and ring finger.

Ctrl+Tab: left ring finger (ctrl) and middle finger (tab) (capslock remapped to ctrl).

Won't help you a) without my hands b) without a keyboard sized similar to mine c) without my remappings.


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#3 2019-07-26 06:38:46

linux_user
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

twoion wrote:

Ctrl+Tab: left ring finger (ctrl) and middle finger (tab) (capslock remapped to ctrl).

Always wondered why capslock was remapped to ctrl by most users and even had a discussion about it on BL forum years back. Now I know why! big_smile

I'll try the Ctrl+Tab out with Capslock+Tab. My pinky finger is pretty agile and strong, so I would go with my pinky finger and ring finger.  big_smile


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#4 2019-09-07 00:00:08

THX1138
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

ctrl, left shift, #, comes more natural to me
hey wait. ctrl alt del is this some kind of windows thing?


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#5 2019-09-07 18:42:22

ohnonot
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

THX1138 wrote:

hey wait. ctrl alt del is this some kind of windows thing?

Apparently it was an IBM PC thing, so not DOS/Windows/MS.

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#6 2019-09-18 02:50:32

linux_user
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

THX1138 wrote:

ctrl, left shift, #, comes more natural to me

And using it for toggling widows or tabs?


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#7 2019-09-18 23:00:39

hhh
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

I always switch our BL Openbox shortcut for window switching from A-Tab/Alt-S-Tab to W-Tab/W-S-Tab and then use A-Tab for 'ShowMenu' (desktop management menu, ie "Add new desktop, Go to, etc...)

I also always switch the window controls Close/Iconify/Maximize from their Fn defaults (A-F3, etc...) to W-q/W-1/W-2

I switch firefox from W-w to W-b so I don't accidently start it when trying to close a window with W-q. tongue

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#8 2019-10-26 18:30:10

linux_user
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

^ That's pretty good deal of remapping there. smile

linux_user wrote:

I'll try the Ctrl+Tab out with Capslock+Tab. My pinky finger is pretty agile and strong, so I would go with my pinky finger and ring finger.  big_smile

I have now gotten used to CapsLock+Tab for Ctrl+Tab with my pinky finger on CapsLock and ring finger on Tab; and Alt+Tab using my thumb finger and ring finger. The travel is much lesser and ergonomics is way better than before.

I do sometimes wish that the Super key was the left half of the space bar. For space, I mostly use my right index finger and the left half is unused and I could have used it as a super key. big_smile


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#9 2019-10-26 19:38:21

glittersloth
...always giving it to you straight
Registered: 2015-09-30
Posts: 900

Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

Having recently gone back to a ThinkPad keyboard with its reversed Fn and Ctrl key placement, I find myself* 'sliding' my left thumb under palm to hit Super or Ctrl while pinky temporarily leaves it's perch on A to hit Tab. Sounds like a recipe for cramp or carpal tunnel, but I'm finding it strangely natural on this particular laptop's (x390) keyboard. If it's something like a Ctrl+A keybind (for tmux), I still revert back to my old method where my left wrist does a slight inward tilt and pinky hits Ctrl while ring finger hits A.

(*) assuming I'm in a proper typing position/posture with four fingers of left hand on ASDF keys and left thumb hovering between the left Alt and Spacebar.

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#10 2019-10-26 20:03:10

Dobbie03
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

I use my thumb and my middle finger for both alt+tab and ctrl+tab.


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#11 2019-10-26 20:10:46

linux_user
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

glittersloth wrote:

I find myself* 'sliding' my left thumb under palm to hit Super or Ctrl while pinky temporarily leaves it's perch on A to hit Tab. Sounds like a recipe for cramp or carpal tunnel.

Indeed sounds like it. smile

glittersloth wrote:

I still revert back to my old method where my left wrist does a slight inward tilt and pinky hits Ctrl while ring finger hits A.

There you go, the easiest thing for you to do is just swap the fn and ctrt keys in bios and you can then use the pinky finger for ctrl and ring finger for A. Or a better thing to do would be to map caplock to Ctrl, and believe me, once you get used to capslock as ctrl key, you'll forget about the fn key and ctrl key in the corner down there. big_smile


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#12 2019-10-27 07:33:20

glittersloth
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Registered: 2015-09-30
Posts: 900

Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

^ I tried the Capslock-to-Ctrl remap multiple times over the years but couldn't bring myself to like it. My muscle memory just refuses the change, and the LED Capslock indicator going on and off would probably drive me nutters. Actually prefer the Fn and Ctrl keys in the "wrong" position now, so much so that I start bitching when I go to my other keyboards.

Fwiw, the "inward tilt" I mentioned isn't as big a movement as I make it sound. I'd have to do it regardless of the Fn/Ctrl key positions, only difference is that with a "correct" keyboard the tilt will make my pinky hover over Fn and Super keys, whereas it now hovers over Ctrl and Super keys, which I find more useful, though I still do the thumb-under-palm thing for Super+Tab related stuff. Also prefer it now because the inward tilt makes my ring finger automatically move over the A key to make tmux/screen related stuff easier, and my index finger feels "freed up" to bend downwards for Ctrl+C/V (copy-pasta nonsense) or straighten up for Ctrl+R/T (reload/new browser tab) actions.

I think palmrest area size and height (relative to keys) probably also play a part in this for most people, so it's obviously YMMV thing. Fwiw, I've also got pretty skinny fingers and anorexic supermodel wrists*, if that matters.

* if you want to start a thread about how modern wristwatches are sized for people who have a staple diet of lard and blubber, I promise to post a lot in it.

Last edited by glittersloth (2019-10-27 12:10:56)

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#13 2019-10-27 13:31:26

Sector11
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From: 77345 ¡#
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Posts: 5,666

Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

hahahahah I  am a three finger and a thumb, look at the keyboard, hunt and peck typer.
I do not qualify as a typist by any stretch of the imagination.

I remember sitting for hours with an MSDOS typing program and got so frustrated that I finally gave up.

I recall that touching the keyboard with my left middle finger causing pain as I had cut off the tip of my finger with a sheet metal cutting table in '68. The scar is directly under the finger nail, and to this day causes a stab of pain if I hit it wrong. So brain said: Do not use that finger.  Put a kink into "hand position" and what that finger hits.

Now saying all that:
Alt-Tab & Ctrl-Tab = left thumb - index finger

Typing has become a new OOPS! for me with a change of keyboards recently.
went from this 18 year old keyboard to this, the difference is size in a tpyo knig's nightmare.

EDIT:  Shown are US Keyboard layouts; mine are, left: latam,  right: Español, that change also causes some OOPSIES!

Last edited by Sector11 (2019-10-27 13:58:12)


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#14 2019-10-27 13:39:04

clusterF
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

Alt + Tab = thumb + middle finger
Ctrl + Tab = thumb + middle finger


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#15 2019-10-27 13:55:17

Sector11
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From: 77345 ¡#
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

clusterF wrote:

Alt + Tab = thumb + middle finger
Ctrl + Tab = thumb + middle finger

See, that's the middle finger I clipped.  wink


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#16 2019-10-27 14:00:42

clusterF
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Registered: 2019-05-07
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Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

Sector11 wrote:
clusterF wrote:

Alt + Tab = thumb + middle finger
Ctrl + Tab = thumb + middle finger

See, that's the middle finger I clipped.  wink

I used to be a two finger typist before i discovered gnu linux.


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#17 2019-10-28 03:59:27

linux_user
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Registered: 2016-11-04
Posts: 418

Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

glittersloth wrote:

^ I tried the Capslock-to-Ctrl remap multiple times over the years but couldn't bring myself to like it. My muscle memory just refuses the change, and the LED Capslock indicator going on and off would probably drive me nutters. Actually prefer the Fn and Ctrl keys in the "wrong" position now, so much so that I start bitching when I go to my other keyboards.

May be trying saying to yourself that the keys are remapped every 5 mins you use the computer and give it time to settle, your muscle memory will change. smile Trust me, it's worth it.

How did you remap it? I remapped it using the configuration provided in autostart. It doesn't toggle the led lights. It acts as a pure ctrl key. However I've noticed on my thinkpad that if I plug out and plugin the external keyboard, I lose the remapping on the external keyboard. I have to log off and restart the login session for the remapping to take effect on external keyboard. Haven't tried this on a pure desktop though.

glittersloth wrote:

I'd have to do it regardless of the Fn/Ctrl key positions, only difference is that with a "correct" keyboard the tilt will make my pinky hover over Fn and Super keys, whereas it now hovers over Ctrl and Super keys, which I find more useful

Thinkpad designs! True, your pinky falls right on the ctrl key. One of the reasons I swapped my Fn-Ctrl to the original; the other reason being CapsLock Ctrl remapping.

glittersloth wrote:

Fwiw, the "inward tilt" I mentioned isn't as big a movement as I make it sound...

Ah, your palm moves a lot smile Try SuperKey for menu instead of Super+Space. It'll be much easier and the config for this is right there in autostart.

glittersloth wrote:

I think palmrest area size and height (relative to keys) probably also play a part in this for most people, so it's obviously YMMV thing. Fwiw, I've also got pretty skinny fingers and anorexic supermodel wrists*, if that matters.

I type in a way that gives me the least traveling for my fingers and palm. I am using 75% mechanical keyboard that is thicker than most keyboards and it was slightly difficult to position my wrists. I remembered Kinesis had designed their Advantage2 keyboard with a 'well' concept. Though, I can't make a well out of my keyboard, I use a book thick as the keyboard as the palm rest to provide a smoother wrist position. It isn't a 'well' but I don't have to bend my wrist upwards too much to reach the keys.

Sector11 wrote:

went from this 18 year old keyboard to this, the difference is size in a tpyo knig's nightmare.

Why did you pick that?

Last edited by linux_user (2019-10-28 04:17:45)


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#18 2019-10-28 15:26:56

Sector11
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From: 77345 ¡#
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Posts: 5,666

Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

OFF TOPIC - buy since asked.

linux_user wrote:
Sector11 wrote:

went from this 18 year old keyboard to this, the difference is size in a tpyo knig's nightmare.

Why did you pick that?

Are you saying "that" like it's a bad thing?

The store had two choices of mechanical keyboards, The rest were Genius "El Cheapos", light as a feather, break in 4-6 months keyboards.  I have half a dozen of them.

Also it is smaller, fits in my computer desk keyboard tray much better.  It is heavy and solid since it is steel construction.

The Redragon keyboards the shop had came in two styles. One with conventional "square" keys and the other with the "typewriter" keys, my wife liked the typewriter keys. After trying it, in the store, she said it feels like the typewriter she learned to type on.  Options here are not as varied as other places.

K591_K556_redragon_keyboards.png
Layout is different, mine is a Spanish layout, can not find an image, and the "Enter" key is an inverted L shape two rows, the Q and A rows, high.

I have the backlight set on solid - as seen in images, not "flashing, blinking or scrolling.  That I find annoying.  Will be testing with all green soon as it's the easiest for me to see.  Maybe red, although not my favourite colour.  Blue, my favourite colour, is too dark on black keys.  sad


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#19 2019-10-28 15:29:42

Sector11
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From: 77345 ¡#
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Posts: 5,666

Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

clusterF wrote:

I used to be a two finger typist before i discovered gnu linux.

gnu two you too.  cool


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#20 2019-10-28 16:28:16

linux_user
Member
Registered: 2016-11-04
Posts: 418

Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

Sector11 wrote:

Are you saying "that" like it's a bad thing?

Ah no, It's just that it was a very unorthodox upgrade: from an old square key keyboard, to an ultra modern typewriter themed keyboard. But I get it now, it's your wife's pick.

...and the "Enter" key is an inverted L shape two rows, the Q and A rows, high.

I hate that layout, known as the British layout. I prefer the general layout. I am not sure why they had to change the layout, it was English itself and not any other language.

I have the backlight set on solid - as seen in images, not "flashing, blinking or scrolling.  That I find annoying.  Will be testing with all green soon as it's the easiest for me to see.  Maybe red, although not my favourite colour.  Blue, my favourite colour, is too dark on black keys.  sad

Haha, I prefer just the plain white color with no flashy animations. I had the option of buying and RGB, but I sticked to the plain white backlit. smile


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#21 2019-10-28 20:17:23

Sector11
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From: 77345 ¡#
Registered: 2015-08-20
Posts: 5,666

Re: What fingers for Alt+Tab and Ctrl+Tab?

@ linux_user

Replied at  Index » Off Topic » S11's Keyboard & Mouse

Because we were getting off topic in an off topic thread threatening to put us on topic in an off topic thread  and I'd have to moderate both of us.


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