Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

clusterF · 2019-11-16 15:09:30

^ Very Irish sentiment you ave there ?

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-16 16:07:47

Aye laddie, am part Mick. Won't tell ya the rest of the genetic makeup. Ya never know when the aliens overlords are listening in.
Ahhhh, who needs dreams, passions and one of those pesky real life things !? That's what TV is for, ... speaking of, this movie isn't going to finish watching itself.

johnraff · 2019-11-17 04:48:17

Different things are getting mixed up here.

1) The polkit thing about fine control of who gets to do what is probably more useful in a corporate context. A single user who can become root any time they want doesn't care.

2) Running graphics apps as root is basically less secure. Why should all those GTK libraries be running with root privileges just to draw something on the screen? Makes no sense. (Personally I try to avoid using sudo wherever possible. Just because I might make a mistake... It happens.) (Sure, X itself runs as root on most systems atm if you use a Display Manager...) So 'pkexec geany' makes no more sense than 'gksu geany' IMO, but we enable it in BL for those users who insist on a root GUI editor and file manager. When I'm feeling lazy I use it myself, but that's different from recommending it.

2a) But it's getting less necessary to run GUI apps directly as root, because more and more of them have their own built-in pkexec calls to a password window that pops up only when you're about to do the real system thing that needs root. Gdebi already does this. You can run it as an ordinary user and it won't ask for a password until you actually try to install something. Same with eg galternatives. Meanwhile Synaptic, Thunar and Gparted have their own arrangements so pkexec works right off, if you need to do that. (With Synaptic and Gparted there's no alternative atm.) So regular users hardly ever need to mess with pkla files. (We on BL have written some though.)

3) Gksu itself is long abandoned, with an already known, OK maybe obscure corner-case, bug, but who knows how many other vulnerabilities? There is a better (IMO) alternative.

Individual users are of course free do do whatever they like, at their own risk.

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-17 09:34:16

^ Hey thanks John-san, way you phrased that made some things a bit clearer for me too. They(upstream) do have to do what they gotta do, more like are going to and if I were in the same position as them would almost certainly be acting in the exact same way too. That being, we're the ones paying for this, we're the ones with the devs, maintainers and people who have the skills to do all this. So all such end-users way down-stream, sthu. Yep this is going to work like this now and that is now that.

Really can only gripe so much, why didn't they do xyz more smoothly, seamlessly, couldn't they have made this more consistent with backwards compatability whaaaa, sniffle, sniffle. End of the day the upstream efforts clearly focus on their agenda, their uses for the platform and it's the golden rule, they who have the gold and do the work, make the rules. Also obviously rules are subject to change w or w/o notice, shrugs. Though certainly do tend to give notice, I mean SysV getting the chop had been discussed forever prior to Systemd, same for Xorg vs Wayland, things supposedly been in development for 10+ yrs already ?

Ah anyway, thanks again for the interesting insights John-san. However ... my swappiness can still kick all heel out of your swappiness value dude! Lmfrikinazzoff ! Being de dork fellas.

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2019-11-17 09:35:02)

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-17 09:53:59

Random on-topicness:

Yep, majority of commercial and enterprise admin's are going to be VERY familiar with command-line, running and maintaining who knows how much, many headless thingy's which don't need/have X anyway. Guess such will have to be addressed for cloud computing, virtualization applications, X forwarding and all that jazz, mobile devices etc etc. Though outright system admin in an enterprise class scenario, many likely live in cli 97% of the time anyway. So revamping the security and containment/isolation of processes in this context is a clear focus. How that impacts us/me as a desktop user is to great extent irrelevant to upstream interests.

nother edit: Also fortunately gaming on gnu/Nix should have plenty of profit potential in it, so fortunate for us casual users, hopefully would mean they'll keep pushing for better graphics support and etc. Though again ... benefits derived for US, are going to be an after-thought or side effect of people trying to develop such for profit.

It's up to us/me to figure out ways to set things up as I prefer. Personally do like graphical tools for mucho stuff, including file managers and text editors to edit system files. Never took the cli challenge for any length of time, never explored cli file-managers to any extent yet. Though actually need to just cause it'll be interesting and yeah, use the mighty nano editor here and there, when I know which file I'm shooting for and it isn't going to take much to edit the thing as needed. Crap have had pdfs/bks on emacs and vim forever and just haven't worked up the desire to learn about them, shrugs.

Really should get rid of gksu for obvious reasons. Though worked great forever and provided I don't do something retarded, as the scenario's I babbled about above the thing should continue working great indefinitely. Know I have to find a better way within a reasonable amount of time though. Don't advise people to hit the lazy button and revert to using it. Are alternatives readily available which would just take me more work.

At the moment just going with what I know, what I'm used to. Will get around to these new approved things sooner or later fellows. Anybody got a recommend for a cli file-manager that's really good ?

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2019-11-17 10:01:06)

glittersloth · 2019-11-17 10:46:51

^ Maybe vifm?
It's relatively easy to use, and will discipline you in vim bindings at the same time.
Once you learn stuff like bulk file renaming in a vi-curses based file manager, the gooey stuff will feel downright clunky.

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-17 11:24:20

^ Hey thanks much Slob-san, cool multi-purpose too.

This begs the inevitable question, which do you/Slob-san (and others) think is the way to go on this issue, vim or emacs ? Keep meaning to bite bullet and learn one of the dang things. One issue I sometimes wind up running into, is default keybinds, I've settled on my preference and keep it consistent across installs. Even regardless of DE/WM I'm dorking with on whichever, though 98% of the time am using Openbox.

F1 - Terminal
F2 - Run dialogue/gmrun usually.
F3 - Text editor (leafpad/mousepad atm)
F4 - File manager (Thunar usually)
F5 - Used to be web browser (FF o course, the only browser worth using. ) Though for awhile have taken to launching it with Ctrl + Up arrow key. Used to have more than one version of FF installed and several of the other browsers, Chrome/ium, Opera etc. So could just hold down the Ctrl key, hit right, up, left and down arrow keys and have 4 web-browsers up and running, before most folks could mouse-over and click on an icon to launch one of the things.

At times, whatever util/app already has shortcuts for these, at such times usually just say screw that util/app and find something else. Am assuming vim/emacs both have files to easily reconfig their keybinds ? Hey ... this could be topic related, someone could use vim to edit files for graphical apps they intend to launch with privileges.

Looks like it's two votes for Vim already. Thanks ClusterF ... Oops epic reading comprehension fail on my part. Slob-san is just noting that, that particular cli file-manager comes with the added benefit of also helping someone learn about Vim. Not so sure he's endorsing Vim over whatever else. Either way it's cool to know.

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2019-11-17 11:38:48)

clusterF · 2019-11-17 11:30:46

^ Learn vim in my opinion, run vimtutor for a good lesson on how to use it first up.

glittersloth · 2019-11-17 12:35:26

BLizgreat! wrote:

vim or emacs ?

Loaded question, that. I'm pleading the 5th. There's enough conflict in the world already.

I personally use vim. That's all I'll say.
Whether vim or emacs, it's always good to learn them proper, either via their in-built tutorials or through some online documentation or printed papyrus. This goes without saying. There's no substitute. It's like garlic powder vs actual garlic. The former is just a simulation. Only the latter is strong enough to ward off vampires.

My suggestion for vifm was just so you could ingrain the basic navigational keybinds as a sort of introduction. There are, of course, other ways to go about it, like the Vimium or Tridactyl plugins for Firefox (or Chrome if you're the exhibitionist type) or vi-like keybinds in your window manager. Gnome Shell even has an "emacs mode" (might need to install gnome-tweaks or edit gsettings to enable), although I've never tried it so can't comment on how extensive it is (eg: whether the bindings extend to Nautilus or GEdit). Again, bear in mind that all of these will only serve as basic introductions and nothing more.

As for your DE/WM keybinds conflicting, I guess that varies by individual/setup. I tend to (as much as possible) map whatever window or launcher related combos to the Super key. That way, it's always Super+whatever or Super+Shift+whatever for DE/WM-related jazz and the in-app shortcuts get to keep their default Function, Alt and Ctrl keybinds. Can't speak for emacs, but if you used default vim (meaning without any crazy remaps) for a bit you'd realize you wouldn't have any conflicts with your Openbox setup.

With regards to "keeping consistency" across your installations, I think it'd be better to ask an actual professional who's worked in the field constantly switching between rigs for a while (maybe @nobody or nore?) rather than a pariah like me.

Edit:
Reminder/PSA - Never take vim seriously. Once you do, life get's turned upside down. You'll wonder why yy isn't yanking shit on someone else's text editor, you'll be totally lost when f doesn't show the link shortcuts on a browser without Vimium installed, and when playing an online game and everyone goes gg at the end for "good game", you'll be sitting there asking yourself why all these people want to scroll to the top of the chat console.

Last edited by glittersloth (2019-11-17 13:09:42)

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-17 12:52:46

Have heard of the famed Vim/emacs wars. Was long before my time though still poked around about it a bit. Lol ... so don't blame you for keeping things brief. Apparently hostilities still fester to this dy among whatever nixers. Anyway, thanks muchas for the info Slob-san, it's appreciated. Hmmmm ya know what they say about great minds, they think alike. Hmmm, this must also apply to bent-minds, we have more than a few similarities me thinks. About the garlic thing ... Allicin. Stuff is supposed to have some kickbutt health bennies assoc with and dang sure won't be found in garlic powder (probably really just another msg infused excitotoxin.) Also for all those dog luvers out there, found out you aren't supposed to give onions/garlic to the things.

Last place I stayed my roommate had a cool lil miniature pincher creature, errrrr, of course I'd already fed him pizza and a bunch of other stuff with onions and garlic in it before discovering the above factoid. Ah didn't hurt him though and who doesn't like pizza ?!?!?

Also thanks for the suggestion about the keybinds PITA Slob, also of course thought of it ( Super or Alt etc) though am somewhat set in my ways, like the convenience of hitting one key and the default terminal popping up, though retraining to use Alt/Super wouldn't take much. Mentioned usually just say screw it this terminal app/util isn't the only way to do whatever in this world or of course could see if I could remap the dang thing in it's configs. Ah screw it.

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2019-11-17 13:02:56)

ohnonot · 2019-11-17 18:32:57

clusterF wrote:

ohnonot wrote:
It's a little sad that these kind of discussions break out whenever some basic software is getting replaced by the majority of distros.
I don't have any sort of emotional bond to my superuser GUI dialog, and I'm sure people who know more about these matters than I had their reasons for changing things.
Intriguing you bring up an emotional response to a computer program in your first sentence then dismiss it with your second sentence??

F* you, clusterF*.

==============================

clusterF wrote:

The average joe who runs a unix desktop for a bit of browsing and such is of no consequence to a multi tiered silicon valley tech giant with server farms and ai research facilities, then again it is probably in there best interest to placate such users to pull data from them. It seems the ultimate goal for modern computing is to in some ways create consumers first through data manipulation and then engineer education to further the goal of consumerism. Granted modern computing is not all this but a good portion today is about selling you the product at all costs. I digress, im getting OT here.

Yes, you are.
Just have to quote this for its babblishness.

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-17 18:46:54

^ Hey no reason to go insulting babbling. Someone having a bad dy ? Though honestly agree with CF, what you contributed was a lame cope out. Ohhh, these changes which I don't understand, are being implemented by people I don't know (though let's assuming it's all ok and they are uber-l33t techno wizards too.) yada, yada blahblahblah.

Verses just going ok, x-nixer is doing something they prefer to their OS/install(s), also noting alternatives and giving prudent warnings etc, no skin offa my tocks. It's gnu/Nix dude, someone being able to do so is a fundamental part of what makes it so dang cool. Also everyone knows there's an ignore feature on these forums right ? Or should we do digital pistols at dawn or ????? Lmao ... never used to do the ignore thing, lately realized how much unnecessary tardation I've been allowing myself to be exposed to though.

So my take on that has radically changed. Got a PLONK/ignore button and am itching to use it !!!

PS, Dammit there's no plonk feature here !!?!?!?! Come on peeps, that's uncool. Ah oh well, I have a scroll thingy too I guess or could use greasemonkey or similar to create my own ignore feature here, shrugs. Which is another short coming I've noted with a bunch of forum software, a user can't plonk a Mod, why ???!!? Someone should be able to plonk anybody they want imo. So at times have explored creating or fiddling together an enhanced client-side plonkinator. So I can put whoever da hades I like on ignore.
Forum admin irritates me ? ... PLONK, shouldn't even see threads the guy starts.

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2019-11-17 18:53:50)

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-17 19:43:31

Funneeeeeee.

This is the same script I'd found long ago when researching this dorkness ! See here, never really got around to settling on something though. Ah it's not that serious, GROUP HUG !?!? Though per usual just calling as I see things, try very hard not to be fulla-chit offline, so why I'd ever do so online ??? Nope ! Ah anyway, isn't a big deal and ignore or no ignore forum feature, no biggie. Should post that in the suggestions section though. For real good fences can make good neighbors.

May or not see if that GM script is workable just cause it's funny, shrugs. Really been meaning to learn more about that add-on and what it can do for quite awhile. Don't so much want to chuff up my firefox with add-on's. Note Also that yeppers, it's a script from some unknown person obviously. Just saying.

clusterF · 2019-11-17 21:58:45

ohnonot wrote:

clusterF wrote:
ohnonot wrote:
It's a little sad that these kind of discussions break out whenever some basic software is getting replaced by the majority of distros.
I don't have any sort of emotional bond to my superuser GUI dialog, and I'm sure people who know more about these matters than I had their reasons for changing things.
Intriguing you bring up an emotional response to a computer program in your first sentence then dismiss it with your second sentence??
F* you, clusterF*.
==============================

I see, so when you have nothing intelligent to say you ad hominem!

damo · 2019-11-17 22:26:01

Hey guys

See my sig for a reminder O:)

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-17 22:38:46

GROUP HUG !!!

Might've stepped into a long running feud without knowing. We've all seen it sometimes nixers in a community just rub each other wrong. I'm staying out of it fellas. Errrr though an old saying does come to mind ...

Arguing with someone on the internet is like competing in the special olympics, even if ya win, you're still just a retard.

Lmao ... errrr want to take this opportunity to errrr apologize to any among us here in the BL crowd who may be, errrrr "special." Uh yeah. No offense, I'm retarded too so no worries. IM'AH SPECIAL DERP ! Ok I better quit ...

glittersloth · 2019-11-18 05:55:46

Not surprised clusterF took it the wrong way. The humor here can be hard to understand at times. Pretty sure ohnonot meant that in jest - probably the first F* being emotional and the second F* emotionless, in reference to clusterF's prior quote - with certain sub-frequencies lost in translation/cross-culturalism. Basically, ohnonot types like Kimi Raikkonen speaks.

...and you can keep your lube to yourselves, damo and biscuit.

ohnonot · 2019-11-18 15:37:39

Sorry Folks, that was agressive and pointless.
I just didn't have enough brain cells left to make an intelligent argument.
But with a user name like that, clusterF, it's bound to happen that someone will play it like this.
People compare me to Petunias all the time.

BLizgreat! · 2019-11-18 16:47:48

Yep I was too quick to jump to post. Think I've got a better idea now, oh well. I like Ohnonot anyway and clusterF is another member of the BL community, also have no problemo with him. Would try a jedi mind trick and try to get the thread back on topic but we all know that never works in any gnu/Nix thread ... EVER.

Ah ... so what are others doing as regarding this ? Using one of the alternatives ? Going with the flow and using pkexec etc ?

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2019-11-18 17:40:57)

damo · 2019-11-18 17:40:35

BLizgreat! wrote:

...
Ah ... so what are others doing as regardless this ? Using one of the alternatives ? Going with the flow and using pkexec etc ?

I go with the flow, and let cleverer linux people than me sort it out

#41 2019-11-16 15:09:30

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#42 2019-11-16 16:07:47

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#43 2019-11-17 04:48:17

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#44 2019-11-17 09:34:16

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#45 2019-11-17 09:53:59

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#46 2019-11-17 10:46:51

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#47 2019-11-17 11:24:20

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#48 2019-11-17 11:30:46

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#49 2019-11-17 12:35:26

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#50 2019-11-17 12:52:46

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#51 2019-11-17 18:32:57

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#52 2019-11-17 18:46:54

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#53 2019-11-17 19:43:31

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#54 2019-11-17 21:58:45

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#55 2019-11-17 22:26:01

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#56 2019-11-17 22:38:46

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#57 2019-11-18 05:55:46

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#58 2019-11-18 15:37:39

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#59 2019-11-18 16:47:48

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

#60 2019-11-18 17:40:35

Re: Removal of gksu/gksudo ... general discussion.

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