Completely Off Topic Chat

rbh · 2020-08-14 07:15:38

johnraff wrote:

Is Chromium developed by a corporation/foundation/business entity?

Yes, by chromium.org. Founded by Google as its opensource counterpart. There is now three other companies active in developing the chromium code: Microsoft, Igalia, Yandex (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromium_(web_browser) )

Last edited by rbh (2020-08-14 07:16:15)

hhh · 2020-08-14 20:30:03

misko_2083 wrote:

I was coughing a little and my father asked why.
I joked it's corona and he replied: "Oh that, and I thought it could be serious."

And... I like your dad.

ohnonot · 2020-08-15 07:59:00

I would gladly pay a monthly $1 subscription or so (easy couple million a year I suppose?) to Firefox in order to ensure further focus and development but looking at Mozilla (the foundation and the corporation) today I'm very unsure where any money would end up.

In retrospect, I would too, but I fear that ship has sailed now.

If Firefox went away, we'd be stuck with a single web engine, that is WebKit/Blink, controlled by MAG (Microsoft, Apple, Google) at its core

...and that's the real crux. Even using cool & obscure but webkit-based browsers (qutebrowser, luakit, surf...) doesn't save the day.

misko_2083 wrote:

Chromium is a stripped down version of Chrome

Not technically true.
Chromium is (the browser built from) the open source project that is the basis for Chrome.
Just like with Android itself, that is Google's business model: use open source software, slap a few small but very significant closed-source bits on it, give it away for free to suck small bits of life force out of you.

glittersloth · 2020-08-15 09:14:00

That's the problem. You like to think your past donations went to Firefox* (plus Rust and Servo, maybe) development, but Mozilla went and spent it on Pocket and other shit. Even a FF-development-only guarantee from them wouldn't inspire much confidence these days. Your money would probably just go to some moronic extension that censure's the word "bitches" from web pages or an address bar that obnoxiously zooms in and out.

cog · 2020-08-15 09:40:14

Firefox is way better/responsive lately than its ever been in my experience. You can also un-tick the things that make you tick.

Don’t know if it actually helps. But yeah it’s accelerated too. Chrome ain’t.

Also in regard to chromium. It’s still kind of evil unless you disable google services from it.

ohnonot · 2020-08-16 07:17:34

cog wrote:

Firefox is way better/responsive lately than its ever been in my experience. You can also un-tick the things that make you tick.
Don’t know if it actually helps. But yeah it’s accelerated too. Chrome ain’t.
Also in regard to chromium. It’s still kind of evil unless you disable google services from it.

I wish one could look at it this way, purely software-wise, but it's gone beyond that - it's become a politicum.
The threat of a browser monopoly, should FF not make it in the end. The lack of choices even now.

Think about how important a web browser is. There's even operating systems that have developed around that. Some people do everything in the browser, and I think it's a safe bet that for the vast majority of computer users, the web browser is the single most used software.

FF are squandering away their chance at being the true alternative, the opposition that has a chance of winning.
They've been doing that for years now truth be told. Some good things might have come from it.

But you are right, FF is pretty snappy these days and extremely configurable (keyword user.js) - incl. all those surveillance capitalism features. I just wish they were opt-in and not opt-out.

So on the other hand I agree that FF is still the "best" option.

ratcheer · 2020-08-16 15:07:36

:thumbup:

Nili · 2020-08-25 16:14:00

I'm very happy with the performance of Mozilla Firefox, As an early user of Iceweasel/Pale Moon for many years I find that Firefox is not the same as i left it in the Australis time.

When I did a system upgrade recently, I thought to give a try version 79.
I was honestly surprised with its performance, layout, simplicity. Today i installed version 80 which performs excellently.

All these years of absence, I am glad to be back in Mozilla Firefox. Even I stayed away from firefox, always have been on the FF family.

hhh · 2020-08-25 21:50:48

ohnonot wrote:

FF are squandering away their chance at being the true alternative, the opposition that has a chance of winning.
They've been doing that for years now truth be told. Some good things might have come from it.

But Firefox is still "open-source" software under the MPL. If the demand was there, a private entrepreneur or a consortium could spin off a privacy-secure version. What's Kali Linux's browser? Is it still Firefox ESR?

ohnonot wrote:

... Google's business model: use open source software, slap a few small but very significant closed-source bits on it, give it away for free to suck small bits of life force out of you.

I love the smell of late-stage-capitalism dystopia in the morning! I smells like... life-force.

hhh · 2020-08-31 08:50:55

My life is complete, I've heard Jeremy Clarkson reference Peter Sellers and say "minkey". @ 2 minutes...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VJ_bKYrfWg

Minkey. 8o

johnraff · 2020-09-01 07:44:24

If you feel you might be starting to get some kind of handle on Regular Expressions...

Have a look at 'man pcre'.

johnraff · 2020-09-01 07:53:35

^A little relief - the tutorials here aren't bad:
https://www.rexegg.com/

ratcheer · 2020-09-01 13:27:39

Sometime before I retired, I determined that I needed to learn regular expressions to be able to do my job better. So I started learning.

Only to find out when trying to use them in various parts of my job (UNIX administration, Oracle databases, various scripting facilities) that seemingly everything used its own variant of regular expressions that didn't match the others. So, instead of becoming more proficient at all of them, I became more confused than ever, and gave up trying to know and understand them. I reverted to looking up how to do what I was doing every time I needed to do it.

I wish you better luck than I had.

Last edited by ratcheer (2020-09-01 13:28:36)

johnraff · 2020-09-02 06:58:32

Luckily today there are a couple of big regex families that look and work largely the same: PCRE, Posix Simple, Posix Extended, and then...

Posix Extended is what bash supports in [[ $var =~ <pattern> ]] and what I'm sort-of familiar with atm. PCRE, I don't think I'll get any deeper in than necessary for the task at hand - right now lookaheads to enable AND grepping with multiple patterns. That's quite doable, and enough for now.

What's interesting about regular expressions is that they are computationally interesting, because they are full-blown state machines, and can do a lot <https://nikic.github.io/2012/06/15/The- … sions.html>

More deep stuff, thank you.
Confirmed what I had long suspected:

nikic wrote:

Well-formed HTML is context-free. So you can match it using regular expressions, contrary to popular opinion.

and

if you are dealing with specific situations a quick regular expression is often the way to go

But also:

But don’t forget two things: Firstly, most HTML you see in the wild is not well-formed (usually not even close to it). And secondly, just because you can, doesn’t mean that you should.

But much of it went as far above my head as 'man pcre'...

Jimbo_G · 2020-09-03 15:14:01

An interesting article about "drastically underestimating economic damages from global warming": https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10 … 20.1807856

johnraff · 2020-09-04 01:41:55

^

...feasible that the economic damages from climate change are at least an order of magnitude worse than forecast by economists, and may be so great as to threaten the survival of human civilization.

30 years ago I came to this conclusion and told everyone I met, sent emails etc...
No-one paid any attention. Got tired and gave up.
I have resigned myself to the end of civilization and pushed it to the back of my mind.

Sorry.

hhh · 2020-09-04 21:58:08

johnraff wrote:

^
...feasible that the economic damages from climate change are at least an order of magnitude worse than forecast by economists, and may be so great as to threaten the survival of human civilization.
30 years ago I came to this conclusion and told everyone I met, sent emails etc...
No-one paid any attention. Got tired and gave up.
I have resigned myself to the end of civilization and pushed it to the back of my mind.
Sorry.

It's what I've said, and more, for over a decade now about the US...

In 1972, when I was 8, I remember the oil embargo with cars lined up for a mile at the gas stations, we knew we had a fossil fuel dependence problem.

I remember a Public Service Announcement of the crying Indian lamenting pollution (a propaganda ad designed to shift blame from corporations to consumers), we knew we had an ecological awareness problem. By the eighties acid rain created by Detroit and other industrial city pollution in the midwest was killing salamanders and other fragile ecosystems in New England and we new it, hence stricter EPA guidelines.

I remember the major interstate I-95 Mianus River Bridge near Bridgeport, CT collapsed in the middle of the night in 1983, sending cars into the river. Three people died, we knew he wad an infrastructure problem.

I saw the reports, year after year, of our education and health systems falling behind in the world, and our tax codes badly in need of restructuring. And all the while the military corporations, the oil companies, the pharmaceutical corporations, the real-estate developers, the insurance companies and the banks got richer and richer.

And we have done almost nothing to address and rectify those major issues in fifty years. Our corporate oligarchy, which is now a global corporate oligarchy, controls government and the result is disaster, because that oligarchy literally only cares about one thing, maximizing profit, and all other concerns be damned.

-edit- It's surreal that my favorite cheesy '70s sci-fi dystopia films like The Omega Man and Rollerball are so poignant to me in 2020.

Last edited by hhh (2020-09-04 22:20:39)

glittersloth · 2020-09-05 04:42:37

I've been telling people for years that we should've kept the two-strokes and killed off cows instead. There'd be less pollution, motorsport would be better, and Frenchmen would have one less thing to fling at us.

damo · 2020-09-05 05:34:58

glittersloth wrote:

I've been telling people for years that we should've kept the two-strokes and killed off cows instead. There'd be less pollution, motorsport would be better, and Frenchmen would have one less thing to fling at us.

Classic g.sloth!

Martin · 2020-09-16 14:22:32

I have noticed this difference between Apple and Android but I never went so far as to calculate the difference. But is this the true TCO? I have zero iOS-device experience and limited Android experience despite having a work phone of that type. I have found a bunch of neat and useful apps for Android for which I have not had to pay (directly). I see people complain about the scarcity of such apps in Apple's walled garden.

I also see/hear complaints that Iphones are 'brittle' but maybe that is history.

Another alternative is the Sony + Sailfish combo. Ohnonot is our expert on that.

For now I cling on to my Nokia 700 (Nokia Belle OS, no updates for many years and no new apps but works just fine for me, YMMV).

Oh, since this is a Linux forum: How do you transfer data between your BL computer and an iOS device? I can do it for an Android device but it is unnecessarily complicated. My Nokia behaves like any old USB stick if I hook it up to my computer. Drag-and-drop or CLI...

/Martin

#3061 2020-08-14 07:15:38

Re: Completely Off Topic Chat

#3062 2020-08-14 20:30:03

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#3063 2020-08-15 07:59:00

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#3064 2020-08-15 09:14:00

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#3065 2020-08-15 09:40:14

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#3066 2020-08-16 07:17:34

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#3067 2020-08-16 15:07:36

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#3068 2020-08-25 16:14:00

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#3069 2020-08-25 21:50:48

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#3070 2020-08-31 08:50:55

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#3071 2020-09-01 07:44:24

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#3072 2020-09-01 07:53:35

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#3073 2020-09-01 13:27:39

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#3074 2020-09-02 06:58:32

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#3075 2020-09-03 15:14:01

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#3076 2020-09-04 01:41:55

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#3078 2020-09-05 04:42:37

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#3079 2020-09-05 05:34:58

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