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#1 2016-12-18 03:17:36

Horizon_Brave
Operating System: Linux-Nettrix
Registered: 2015-10-18
Posts: 1,473

Hardware Accerlation Questions..

I was going to attach a question to one of the threads in the basic support forum...but as always the question ran away with me, and it was too big, that it would have derailed the thread...So this goes out to the wise Bunsen-Labs council...

Many times for graphical related errors, screen freezes, system crashes etc... the problem of disabling hardware acceleration in the program comes up....  So Just to clarify this... a Hardware Acceleration problem, the fundamentals of it, is that whatever program it is that is using H.A is trying to make use of the CPU/GPU... not through the normal circuitry, but through specially designed buses that can provide better refresh, video sync, and overall display...  Now where does the problem come in with this?  Would it be the kernel that would cause errors with Hardware Acceleration or something specific to a users graphics card or cpu?   

Likewise if someone has a program that's running and has Hardware Acceleration turned on by default, but the user has and older chip that has no ability for hardware acceleration is this always a problem? Or is it the kernel, and how it handles the requests for H.A, the main problem?  (microcode or kernel headers?)


"I have not failed, I have found 10,000 ways that will not work" -Edison

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#2 2016-12-18 10:39:40

Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

Have you read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardware_acceleration?

The only time HA usually presents a problem is when users attempt to start the full GNOME shell without a capable GPU and get told:

Oh no! Something went wrong.

To get it working, the simple solution is to select the "fallback" desktop or use something like openbox instead.

Having said that, HA for video players and (especially) browsers is something that can be a real challenge under GNU/Linux -- for example, true 10-bit support for video decoding simply does not exist sad


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#3 2016-12-18 14:10:54

Sector11
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From: Upstairs
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Posts: 6,666

Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

Iceweasel - about:support page:

GPU Accelerated Windows	0/1 Basic (OMTC) 

OLD graphics card/drivers   cry  cry  cry

But:

 18 Dec 16 @ 11:11:42 ~
  $ glxinfo | grep "direct rendering"
direct rendering: Yes

confused....


The sun will never set if you keep walking towards it. - my son
Being positive doesn't understand physics.
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#4 2016-12-18 15:17:15

Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

^ Your desktop fully supports 3D acceleration but Firefox/Iceweasel does not.

FF likes to pretend that it can use the GPU under GNU/Linux but the provided checkbox is purely placebo in nature and does absolutely nothing.

The only way to get GPU acceleration for videos in a GNU/Linux browser is to use the PPAPI ("PepperFlash") player and this will soon no longer work for Firefox because Google have stopped supplying libpepflashplayer.so, so it will only be possible to use this through Google Chrome.


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#5 2016-12-18 18:35:25

Sector11
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

Ahhhhhhhh well ain't that a pretty pickle!  Goofle, didn't I start a "Do we really need Google" thread?  Yup, that was me.

And I have pepperflash too!

  $ ser pepper
alias ser = aptitude search
i   browser-plugin-freshplayer-pepperflash                         - PPAPI-host NPAPI-plugin adapter for pepperflash                          
p   browser-plugin-freshplayer-pepperflash:i386                    - PPAPI-host NPAPI-plugin adapter for pepperflash                          
p   bunsen-pepperflash                                             - Pepper Flash Player - browser plugin                                     
p   bunsen-pepperflash:i386                                        - Pepper Flash Player - browser plugin                                     
p   libjs-jquery-ui-theme-pepper-grinder                           - Pepper Grinder theme for jQuery UI                                       
p   pepper                                                         - Source code repository statistics and report tool                        
p   pepper:i386                                                    - Source code repository statistics and report tool                        
i A pepperflashplugin-nonfree                                      - Pepper Flash Player - browser plugin  

Thanks HoaS as usual, you're on top of things.


The sun will never set if you keep walking towards it. - my son
Being positive doesn't understand physics.
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#6 2016-12-18 18:36:14

Sector11
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From: Upstairs
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

hahahaha Goofle - great typo - it stays!


The sun will never set if you keep walking towards it. - my son
Being positive doesn't understand physics.
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#7 2016-12-18 18:43:16

Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

With apologies to H_B for the thread drift...

Sector11 wrote:

And I have pepperflash too!

You could try forcing FlashPlayer for online videos and see if your GPU can handle things any better:

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-GB/firefo … sh-player/

For this to work, you would need the browser-plugin-freshplayer-pepperflash package installed to allow Firefox to use the PepperFlash plugin.

EDIT: However, I'm not sure if the above-named package will actually work given the bug report to which I linked in my earlier post hmm

Last edited by Head_on_a_Stick (2016-12-18 18:46:25)


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#8 2016-12-18 18:53:46

Sector11
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

@ H_B - I'll continue elsewhere as well.  Sorry.


The sun will never set if you keep walking towards it. - my son
Being positive doesn't understand physics.
_______________________________
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#9 2016-12-18 22:58:58

Horizon_Brave
Operating System: Linux-Nettrix
Registered: 2015-10-18
Posts: 1,473

Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

No worries about the thread drift.

But to just re-iterate, GPU acceleration and Hardware acceleration are synonomous correct?

Also  Sector11, you posted the output of

glxinfo | grep "direct rendering"
direct rendering: Yes

this 'direct rendering', I'm assuming is the output for saying "I support gpu hardware acceleration!"  ?

So let's say you had a really new GPU, hardware etc, that does have Hardware acceleration.  Also let's assume you're using an application that *does* support and make use of hardware acceleration (maybe vlc player)

But if you install Debian stable, or an older kernel  that doesn't know about hardware acceleration would this present an issue? Basically I want to know the disconnect between where support needs to be had for this. The hardware must obviously have it, and the application being used must make use of it, but what is inbetween that needs to "connect" the two?


"I have not failed, I have found 10,000 ways that will not work" -Edison

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#10 2016-12-18 23:14:25

Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

Horizon_Brave wrote:

GPU acceleration and Hardware acceleration are synonomous correct

Yes.

EDIT: No!

Some CPUs support HA as well.

Last edited by Head_on_a_Stick (2016-12-18 23:15:52)


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#11 2016-12-18 23:22:28

Sector11
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From: Upstairs
Registered: 2015-08-20
Posts: 6,666

Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

To the best of my knowledge that what it means, that my GPU, and it's OLD, has 'acceleration'.

 18 Dec 16 @ 20:20:49 ~
  $ gra
Graphics:  Card: NVIDIA GT218 [GeForce 210] bus-ID: 02:00.0
           Display Server: X.Org 1.16.4 driver: nvidia Resolution: 1920x1080@60.00hz
           GLX Renderer: GeForce 210/PCIe/SSE2 GLX Version: 3.3.0 NVIDIA 340.93 Direct Rendering: Yes
 
 18 Dec 16 @ 20:20:53 ~
  $ 
 18 Dec 16 @ 20:21:25 ~
  $ alias | grep gra=
alias gra='inxi -Gx'

Anything after your "So let's say ..." will have to be addressed by someone with mopre savy than I have.  Sorry ... I'm fumbling in the dark here myself.


The sun will never set if you keep walking towards it. - my son
Being positive doesn't understand physics.
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#12 2016-12-19 00:23:00

Horizon_Brave
Operating System: Linux-Nettrix
Registered: 2015-10-18
Posts: 1,473

Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

Thanks Sector11,  and hey two people fumbling is better than one fumbling alone!   wink

Thanks for the response hoas.  Also remember there's the adobe labs flash player here, that's still being supported, but remember it's still beta:

http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/flas … ashplayer/


"I have not failed, I have found 10,000 ways that will not work" -Edison

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#13 2016-12-19 00:29:16

Sector11
Conky 1.9er Mod Squid
From: Upstairs
Registered: 2015-08-20
Posts: 6,666

Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

Horizon_Brave wrote:

Thanks Sector11,  and hey two people fumbling is better than one fumbling alone!   wink

If for nothing else we know that we are not alone!  I'll grab that "tid", you grab that "bit" and we'll have ourselves a "tidbit".  cool

Horizon_Brave wrote:

Thanks for the response hoas.  Also remember there's the adobe labs flash player here, that's still being supported, but remember it's still beta:

http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/flas … ashplayer/

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm... is it better or worse?  After all it's still flash.

And I'm guessing it's either one or the other - not both.


The sun will never set if you keep walking towards it. - my son
Being positive doesn't understand physics.
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#14 2016-12-19 02:07:36

johnraff
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

@H_B humblest apologies for continuing the Flash sidebar, but this is important (to me anyway) and I want to respond to our good HoaS's statement here:

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

The only way to get GPU acceleration for videos in a GNU/Linux browser is to use the PPAPI ("PepperFlash") player and this will soon no longer work for Firefox because Google have stopped supplying libpepflashplayer.so, so it will only be possible to use this through Google Chrome.

Quick update/reminder:
1) We have a native BL package bunsen-pepperflash which installs libpepflashplayer.so directly from Adobe, so as long as Adobe keep providing it, we're OK.
2) Adobe's previously beta updates of the NPAPI plugin are now mainstream. The NPAPI and PPAPI libraries are at the same version, so NPAPI also remains a reasonable option for Firefox.
3) Debian's pepperflashplugin-nonfree might be getting an update, which will eventually make our package redundant (probably not for a while, though).

Last edited by johnraff (2016-12-19 06:07:40)


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#15 2016-12-19 04:23:15

Horizon_Brave
Operating System: Linux-Nettrix
Registered: 2015-10-18
Posts: 1,473

Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

@ J.Raff

"Get off my topic you kids!!"

Haha, You guys should know, I am NO stranger to asking questions mid thread, and having open discussion, especially when others benefit from in. No need to apologize guys, I don't take offense! I'm happy to provide a 'platform' where this can be discussed...

Now answer my questions John!!   mad   tongue


"I have not failed, I have found 10,000 ways that will not work" -Edison

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#16 2016-12-19 06:09:15

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,024
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

Horizon_Brave wrote:

Now answer my questions John!!

Ha! Wish I could, but this is way outside my zone.


...elevator in the Brain Hotel, broken down but just as well...
( a boring Japan blog (currently paused), idle Twitterings and GitStuff )

Introduction to the Bunsenlabs Lithium Desktop

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#17 2016-12-19 07:14:04

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 8,759
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Re: Hardware Accerlation Questions..

johnraff wrote:

NPAPI also remains a reasonable option for Firefox.

Not in respect of hardware acceleration for videos, or DRM-restricted content, these features are only available with PPAPI.


“Et ignotas animum dimittit in artes.” — Ovid, Metamorphoses, VIII., 18.

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