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#1 2020-04-22 06:12:05

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
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Techy stuff for developers

A sort of techy version of "Cool Random Internet Stuff" but with the focus on Desktop development, Debian Installer, ISO building and the like. Short posts that don't justify a dedicated thread.

This is mainly stuff that would be of interest to BunsenLabs developers I guess, but there's no reason not to share it publicly here IMO.

First up:
debian preseed file
This is where you can set all kinds of tweaks for Debian-Installer when it goes about its work. There are some example files around the web, but they don't cover all the possibilities by far, partly because they keep changing and depend on the various bits of Debian Installer.

Anyway, today I ran into this post by Debian dev Steve McIntyre:
https://jack.einval.com/debian-preseed/
He's written a script to extract all the options, and here's an example reference for buster - amd64 - main:
https://jack.einval.com/debian-preseed/ … n-full.txt

Somebody with time on their hands might enjoy going over that list. smile

Last edited by johnraff (2020-05-18 02:20:47)


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#2 2020-05-18 02:22:53

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
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Re: Techy stuff for developers

Debian Derivatives

The Debian Wiki has some guidelines for Derivatives:
https://wiki.debian.org/Derivatives/Guidelines

And keeping Lintian in the picture:
https://wiki.debian.org/Lintian/Vendors


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#3 2020-06-08 05:15:36

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
Website

Re: Techy stuff for developers

Where do lightdm and lightdm-gtk-greeter store session & locale?

Spent about half a day last week trying to find out where the lightdm login window was getting its default xsession and language choices from. Once a user has chosen something, it's really hard to undo...  neutral

I'm not sure if the priority goes like this, but user choices could be in any, or all, of these:

/home/<user>/.dmrc
/var/lib/AccountsService/users/<user>
/var/cache/lightdm/dmrc/<user>.dmrc
/var/lib/lightdm/.cache/lightdm-gtk-greeter/state

These system files have lower priority, but a default user-session might be set there:

/usr/share/lightdm/lightdm.conf.d/*
/etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf


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#4 2020-06-08 06:10:42

hhh
Meep!
Registered: 2015-09-17
Posts: 12,032
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Re: Techy stuff for developers

Installer theming. I forget the file paths, but when I was trying to decipher live-build for the first hydrogen build, I probably spent a month researching every mailing list for the info. Anyway, it's a banner image and a gtk2 theme once you know where to put them.

Still no fun, the Debian Live Manual. It's sparse...

https://live-team.pages.debian.net/live … ex.en.html

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#5 2020-06-08 06:22:13

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
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Re: Techy stuff for developers

^Yes, although people associated with live-build seem now to be putting some time into improving it - at least correcting obsolete info and making some parts more comprehensible.

Debian mailing list:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-live/


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#6 2021-01-18 07:34:30

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
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Re: Techy stuff for developers

Debian Quick Image Baker pre-baked images

Downloadable images that can be run on QEMU:

https://people.debian.org/~gio/dqib/

I haven't tried any, but might be interesting, especially for unusual architectures.


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#7 2021-01-18 07:35:26

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
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Re: Techy stuff for developers

Debian Glossary

explanations of a lot of those cryptic acronyms

https://wiki.debian.org/Glossary


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#8 2021-01-18 14:26:17

sleekmason
zoom
Registered: 2018-05-22
Posts: 584

Re: Techy stuff for developers

hhh wrote:

Installer theming. I forget the file paths, but when I was trying to decipher live-build for the first hydrogen build, I probably spent a month researching every mailing list for the info. Anyway, it's a banner image and a gtk2 theme once you know where to put them.

Still no fun, the Debian Live Manual. It's sparse...

https://live-team.pages.debian.net/live … ex.en.html

I know for the initial splash image, just change out the splash image in /config/bootloaders/isolinux/splash.svg with a .png 640x480 of your choosing. 

If you run across your notes, would love to know where these other two are.
Guessing your talking about the image displayed during the process itself?

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#9 2021-01-19 06:27:47

ohnonot
...again
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 5,532

Re: Techy stuff for developers

sleekmason wrote:

I know for the initial splash image, just change out the splash image in /config/bootloaders/isolinux/splash.svg with a .png 640x480 of your choosing.

Why not an .svg?


Give to COVAX! Here or here. (explanation)

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#10 2021-01-19 13:48:19

sleekmason
zoom
Registered: 2018-05-22
Posts: 584

Re: Techy stuff for developers

ohnonot wrote:
sleekmason wrote:

I know for the initial splash image, just change out the splash image in /config/bootloaders/isolinux/splash.svg with a .png 640x480 of your choosing.

Why not an .svg?

Right?

When modifying one of the default themes, if you want to use a personalized background image that will be displayed together with the boot menu, add a splash.png picture of 640x480 pixels. Then, remove the splash.svg file.

https://live-team.pages.debian.net/live … ry.en.html

Guessing another .svg would work fine. Maybe just wanted people to know a .png would work as well.

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#11 2021-01-28 16:28:38

sleekmason
zoom
Registered: 2018-05-22
Posts: 584

Re: Techy stuff for developers

Dconf settings.  Was trying to figure out how to save dconf settings for plank and the like.

After searching and finding only headaches, it occurred to me to simply copy the ~/.config/dconf from the live session.  This works!

Just make any changes to the app(s) in question in a live session, logout and back in to get your shiny new dconf file to add to the distro.

Was able to change plank positioning and transparency.  now to figure out everything that uses dconf for settings.

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#12 2021-01-29 02:52:18

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
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Re: Techy stuff for developers

^Just copying the dconf binary data base does work, but it might break if copying to a different system, and all settings would be overwritten. There's a "proper" way, using the package dconf-cli. It comes with BL Lithium by default, as a dependency of bunsen-utilities, but you can install it if necessary.

The command is dconf, and as usual man dconf will give you the whole story.

'dconf dump /' to see all the stored data. (Note: the "directory path" is not a real directory, it's about the config data hierarchy.)
Other commands I've used: 'dconf load' and 'dconf reset'.

Basic save/restore flow (eg for mate-terminal):

dconf dump /org/mate/terminal/ > path/to/dconf-mateterm
# if data is missing it will just create an empty file

## then at restore time
dconf reset -f /org/mate/terminal/

dconf load /org/mate/terminal/ < path/to/dconf-mateterm

The "directory" paths you have to find out  - if the app is installed you can see it via 'dconf dump /'.

The BLOB utility does something like this to save and restore dconf data:
https://github.com/BunsenLabs/bunsen-ut … hemes#L689
https://github.com/BunsenLabs/bunsen-ut … emes#L1718


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#13 2021-01-29 03:34:55

sleekmason
zoom
Registered: 2018-05-22
Posts: 584

Re: Techy stuff for developers

johnraff wrote:

^Just copying the dconf binary data base does work, but it might break if copying to a different system, and all settings would be overwritten. There's a "proper" way, using the package dconf-cli. It comes with BL Lithium by default, as a dependency of bunsen-utilities, but you can install it if necessary.

The command is dconf, and as usual man dconf will give you the whole story.

'dconf dump /' to see all the stored data. (Note: the "directory path" is not a real directory, it's about the config data hierarchy.)
Other commands I've used: 'dconf load' and 'dconf reset'.

Basic save/restore flow (eg for mate-terminal):

dconf dump /org/mate/terminal/ > path/to/dconf-mateterm
# if data is missing it will just create an empty file

## then at restore time
dconf reset -f /org/mate/terminal/

dconf load /org/mate/terminal/ < path/to/dconf-mateterm

The "directory" paths you have to find out  - if the app is installed you can see it via 'dconf dump /'.

The BLOB utility does something like this to save and restore dconf data:
https://github.com/BunsenLabs/bunsen-ut … hemes#L689
https://github.com/BunsenLabs/bunsen-ut … emes#L1718

Really good info!  Thank you for posting the correct way.  Couldn't get it figured.

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#14 2021-02-02 02:55:30

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
Website

Re: Techy stuff for developers

Debian Packaging: some detailed info from the horse's mouth. Seems to be up to date.

Debian New Maintainers' Guide
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/main … ex.en.html

Guide for Debian Maintainers
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debm … ex.en.html
especially Chapter 5. Basics
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debm … 05.en.html


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#15 2021-05-08 04:57:55

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
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Re: Techy stuff for developers

Reproducible Live images

This page tracks the progress on creating reproducible live images, using live-build from DebianLive

Some content here possibly of interest to people using live-build (@sleekmason?).

https://wiki.debian.org/ReproducibleInstalls/LiveImages


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#16 2021-05-09 19:30:53

sleekmason
zoom
Registered: 2018-05-22
Posts: 584

Re: Techy stuff for developers

johnraff wrote:

Reproducible Live images

This page tracks the progress on creating reproducible live images, using live-build from DebianLive

Some content here possibly of interest to people using live-build (@sleekmason?).

https://wiki.debian.org/ReproducibleInstalls/LiveImages

Looks interesting!  Thank you for posting the link.

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#17 2021-07-04 06:34:15

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
Website

Re: Techy stuff for developers

Migrating away from apt-key
Developer blog post.
https://blog.jak-linux.org/2021/06/20/m … y-apt-key/


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#18 2021-07-25 03:13:15

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
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Re: Techy stuff for developers

Recent Debian devs discussion of firmware in Debian-Installer:

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugrepo … bug=989863

Somewhat technical but not irrelevant to BL developers.

One interesting bit to drop out: isenkram for helping find missing firmware:
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram-cli


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#19 2021-07-25 08:22:23

twoion
ほやほや
Registered: 2015-08-10
Posts: 3,248

Re: Techy stuff for developers

johnraff wrote:

Recent Debian devs discussion of firmware in Debian-Installer:

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugrepo … bug=989863

Somewhat technical but not irrelevant to BL developers.

One interesting bit to drop out: isenkram for helping find missing firmware:
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram-cli

They should just follow the Arch linux way and ship a single package linux-firmware...problem solved. Always all firmware installed. This is really a homegrown issue. Arguably, BL could decide to always install all firmware packages. Bit of disk space, lots of compatibility.


Nassdachs

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#20 2021-07-25 12:57:30

jeffreyC
Member
Registered: 2019-09-07
Posts: 53

Re: Techy stuff for developers

twoion wrote:
johnraff wrote:

Recent Debian devs discussion of firmware in Debian-Installer:

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugrepo … bug=989863

Somewhat technical but not irrelevant to BL developers.

One interesting bit to drop out: isenkram for helping find missing firmware:
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram-cli

They should just follow the Arch linux way and ship a single package linux-firmware...problem solved. Always all firmware installed. This is really a homegrown issue. Arguably, BL could decide to always install all firmware packages. Bit of disk space, lots of compatibility.

Ubuntu does it that way, their firmware package is over 200mb last time I looked.
As seldom as Debian updates their firmware it would not be a huge problem for most people on metered internet I guess.
But it does seem to be a brute force approach for people who only need a very few small parts of the package.

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#21 2021-07-25 17:24:43

DeepDayze
Like sands through an hourglass...
From: In Linux Land
Registered: 2017-05-28
Posts: 1,278

Re: Techy stuff for developers

twoion wrote:
johnraff wrote:

Recent Debian devs discussion of firmware in Debian-Installer:

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugrepo … bug=989863

Somewhat technical but not irrelevant to BL developers.

One interesting bit to drop out: isenkram for helping find missing firmware:
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram-cli

They should just follow the Arch linux way and ship a single package linux-firmware...problem solved. Always all firmware installed. This is really a homegrown issue. Arguably, BL could decide to always install all firmware packages. Bit of disk space, lots of compatibility.

Perhaps one giant meta-package to pull all the firmware in? Perhaps BL could ship one called something like bunsen-firmware-all.

Thoughts?


Real Men Use Linux

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#22 2021-07-25 18:29:02

twoion
ほやほや
Registered: 2015-08-10
Posts: 3,248

Re: Techy stuff for developers

DeepDayze wrote:
twoion wrote:
johnraff wrote:

Recent Debian devs discussion of firmware in Debian-Installer:

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugrepo … bug=989863

Somewhat technical but not irrelevant to BL developers.

One interesting bit to drop out: isenkram for helping find missing firmware:
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram
https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/isenkram-cli

They should just follow the Arch linux way and ship a single package linux-firmware...problem solved. Always all firmware installed. This is really a homegrown issue. Arguably, BL could decide to always install all firmware packages. Bit of disk space, lots of compatibility.

Perhaps one giant meta-package to pull all the firmware in? Perhaps BL could ship one called something like bunsen-firmware-all.

Thoughts?

We need to sort through Debian first. They also have some big ass meta packages that include a lot but not quite all. All-firmwares-in-the-box would be really great however. Esp. since BL focusses on having things work and not hardcore FOSS I don't see why users shouldn't enjoy a 2021 appropriate experience smile The DVD install ISOs are not getting smaller anyway, and if need be, the firmwares can still be excluded from the CD sized ISO if they happen to be 500M+ in size.


Nassdachs

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#23 2021-07-25 20:12:07

DeepDayze
Like sands through an hourglass...
From: In Linux Land
Registered: 2017-05-28
Posts: 1,278

Re: Techy stuff for developers

twoion wrote:
DeepDayze wrote:
twoion wrote:

They should just follow the Arch linux way and ship a single package linux-firmware...problem solved. Always all firmware installed. This is really a homegrown issue. Arguably, BL could decide to always install all firmware packages. Bit of disk space, lots of compatibility.

Perhaps one giant meta-package to pull all the firmware in? Perhaps BL could ship one called something like bunsen-firmware-all.

Thoughts?

We need to sort through Debian first. They also have some big ass meta packages that include a lot but not quite all. All-firmwares-in-the-box would be really great however. Esp. since BL focusses on having things work and not hardcore FOSS I don't see why users shouldn't enjoy a 2021 appropriate experience smile The DVD install ISOs are not getting smaller anyway, and if need be, the firmwares can still be excluded from the CD sized ISO if they happen to be 500M+ in size.

Thanks for the feedback and perhaps maybe not on the ISO itself but available thru the BL repos even. Would be good for Debian to sort it out first however like you mentioned.


Real Men Use Linux

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#24 2021-07-25 22:35:16

hhh
Meep!
Registered: 2015-09-17
Posts: 12,032
Website

Re: Techy stuff for developers

twoion wrote:
DeepDayze wrote:
twoion wrote:

They should just follow the Arch linux way and ship a single package linux-firmware...problem solved. Always all firmware installed. This is really a homegrown issue. Arguably, BL could decide to always install all firmware packages. Bit of disk space, lots of compatibility.

Perhaps one giant meta-package to pull all the firmware in? Perhaps BL could ship one called something like bunsen-firmware-all.

Thoughts?

We need to sort through Debian first. They also have some big ass meta packages that include a lot but not quite all. All-firmwares-in-the-box would be really great however. Esp. since BL focusses on having things work and not hardcore FOSS I don't see why users shouldn't enjoy a 2021 appropriate experience smile The DVD install ISOs are not getting smaller anyway, and if need be, the firmwares can still be excluded from the CD sized ISO if they happen to be 500M+ in size.

We also need to wait for the Bullseye release. Nothing has been actually finalized yet. Ardour stopped working a week ago and now works again with the latest updates, which include a new kernel, for example.

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#25 2021-07-26 00:15:59

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 8,168
Website

Re: Techy stuff for developers

Hey guys, take a look at the current BL default package list, for example in bunsen-meta-all:
https://github.com/BunsenLabs/bunsen-me … an/control

The Beryllium list is still in flux, but atm holds:
firmware-b43-installer
firmware-b43legacy-installer
firmware-linux
firmware-realtek
firmware-iwlwifi

firmware-linux is a Debian metapackage, depending in turn on firmware-linux-free and firmware-linux-nonfree

So we already ship quite a lot of firmware out of the box.

At installation time the show-stopper is wireless, especially the b43 stuff which has to be downloaded (nice Catch 22) but thanks to @hhh's work in the past we ship the necessary b43 firmware in the iso.

There's a lot of other firmware in the Debian repos though:
https://packages.debian.org/search?suit … s=firmware

As DeepDaze suggests, we could create a new bunsen-firmware-all metapackage to pull all, or a subset, of it, and either add it by default or just make it available in the BL repos? It might make life simpler for some users?

PS It might be interesting to see what firmware Ubuntu selected to go in their Big Blob.

Last edited by johnraff (2021-07-26 00:21:18)


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