A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

Döbbie03 · 2023-11-20 07:07:30

Oh I should mention that scaling is a bit of a manual process. You need to phyiscally measure the viewable size of your panel then enter the values here:

https://www.sven.de/dpi/

Then apply it via .Xresources.

I may be creating an issue that doesn't really need to be looked at. Especially as there has been no complaints or issues raised previously.

hhh · 2023-11-20 07:08:17

@Dobbie03, so I think that will have to be up to the user. We use lxappearance, not xfce4-settings-manager.

Döbbie03 · 2023-11-20 07:12:42

ah well, lx-appearance creates ~/.gtkrc-2.0 so the cursor script accomodates for that.

I agree it should be up to the user.

johnraff · 2023-11-20 07:28:16

hhh wrote:

johnraff wrote:
I was wondering about the clearlooks messages. Installing gtk2-engines gets rid of them - it's only "1,629 kB of additional disk space" so we could add it to the install list?...Do we gain anything from having gtk2-engines?
No, let's not worry about it.

OK

I just noticed, we don't include mpv?

No. We ship vlc, which can do just about anything. If a user installs mpv they will find some helpful wrapper scripts and config have already been provided. But I don't think we need two media players OOTB do we?

The lite package list pulls mpv instead of vlc.

johnraff · 2023-12-01 05:40:46

Dobbie03 wrote:

What is the main factor that produces such a large ISO?

A big one that I forgot to mention is firmware. Some of those non-free firmware packages are in the tens of MB so you can easily hit several hundreds by installing all the firmware that's going - as we do, to make life as easy as possible for new users.

Debian's recent changes might make it easier to leave some of the firmware out of the ISO and pull in what's needed at install time.

Döbbie03 · 2023-12-01 05:46:29

Okay that makes perfect sense. Thanks for the reply

johnraff · 2023-12-01 08:05:20

hhh wrote:

Dobbie, download Boron-aqua-test from here and let me know what you see...
https://github.com/hhhorb/boron-themes
I haven't checked it on the TV yet, so I have no idea if the 2x assets do anything. Also check for .xsession-errors (also John, please). I see a clearlooks warning when I launch vlc from a terminal, but I'm not worried about that. I'm worried about the dozens of "deprecated" scss warnings we were getting with the original themes.

Sorry it took me so long to remember about this.
I got no GTK deprecations or warnings when launching things in terminal, except for the vlc thing about clearlooks.
xsession-errors is full of "Xlib: ignoring invalid extension event" messages, but that's not you it's picom:
https://github.com/yshui/picom/issues/1096
I couldn't see anything which looked like a GTK theme issue.
xfce apps throwing out GLib warnings as before.

I noticed some small changes in layout - geany tabs are a bit bigger - but no particular problem at this end.

You put no openbox theme in there, but this is still a test theme anyway?

Is it OK to move forward towards a Release Candidate with the current themes as shipped in bunsen-themes for the moment?

hhh · 2023-12-01 15:13:44

^ No, no Openbox theme. If the layout change is minimal enough to be acceptable, just use these GTK folders in current Aqua, with it's index file, assets folder, openbox and notification themes. You can leave out the xfwm4 theme, I created that to see how it would look on Xfce but it didn't look good at all IIRC.

re RC: Please let the dogs out! I've been messing with simplescreenshootersimplescreenrecorder, shotcut and ardour. The learning curve for shotcut and ardour are, as they say in New England, wicked steep, but I'm learning bit by bit so I can produce a YT video showcasing Boron. Keep an eye out for a fledgling example in this months Screenshot thread (maybe even when you log on next)!

Last edited by hhh (2023-12-01 15:14:42)

johnraff · 2023-12-03 01:56:01

OK I'll get on it.

hhh wrote:

You can leave out the xfwm4 theme, I created that to see how it would look on Xfce but it didn't look good at all IIRC.

Does that apply to the existing Boron themes too, or just Boron-aqua-test?

hhh · 2023-12-03 02:42:10

I'd leave them out. They were built by Oomox and I left them in but I haven't tested them. They're probably crap!

Hey, do me two favors with this build...

1) Leave my picom settings in but commented out (left/right/radius/opacity)

2) Include a line for touchpad right-click in bl-autostart, also commented out. This should do...

synclient VertEdgeScroll=0 VertTwoFingerScroll=0 HorizEdgeScroll=0 TapButton1=1 TapButton2=3 TapButton3=2

Or maybe even...

synclient VertEdgeScroll=0 VertTwoFingerScroll=0 HorizEdgeScroll=0 TapButton1=1 TapButton2=3 TapButton3=2 PalmDetect=1 PalmMinWidth=4 PalmMinZ=100

If we get any questions about touchpad right-click/middle-click, we can just point them to this entry. You can enable the scrolling as you see fit, of course. Thanks!

hhh · 2023-12-03 02:44:59

@John, I forget to mention... I know you're in the hills, but I hope your friends aren't impacted by the Philippines earthquake. I saw that there were Tsunami warnings issued.

Last edited by hhh (2023-12-03 02:49:18)

johnraff · 2023-12-03 06:21:55

hhh wrote:

If the layout change is minimal enough to be acceptable, just use these GTK folders in current Aqua, with it's ...assets folder...

The assets folder in Boron-aqua is somewhat different from that in Boron-aqua-test. OK to keep the original Boron-aqua assets?

---
Also Boron-aqua-test is yet bigger than Boron-aqua, 15MB from 10MB. This is serious bulk: I wonder if we can cut it down a bit?

I think most of it comes from gtk-3.0/gtk.gresource which Boron-alpha manages without somehow. (OTOH gtk-3.20/gtk.gresource is bigger in Boron-aqua, 8.3MB vs 5.4MB in Boron-aqua-test.)

It would be a serious jump in package size if all four Boron-* themes went from 10MB to 15MB, especially considering Dragon is 250kB, Lithium 2MB, Beam 460kB...

Last edited by johnraff (2023-12-03 06:55:02)

johnraff · 2023-12-03 06:24:18

hhh wrote:

1) Leave my picom settings in but commented out (left/right/radius/opacity)
2) Include a line for touchpad right-click in bl-autostart, also commented out. This should do...
synclient VertEdgeScroll=0 VertTwoFingerScroll=0 HorizEdgeScroll=0 TapButton1=1 TapButton2=3 TapButton3=2
Or maybe even...
synclient VertEdgeScroll=0 VertTwoFingerScroll=0 HorizEdgeScroll=0 TapButton1=1 TapButton2=3 TapButton3=2 PalmDetect=1 PalmMinWidth=4 PalmMinZ=100

No problem with either of those. Take the "Or maybe even..." synclient version?

johnraff · 2023-12-03 06:41:15

hhh wrote:

@John, I forget to mention... I know you're in the hills, but I hope your friends aren't impacted by the Philippines earthquake. I saw that there were Tsunami warnings issued.

Everything's OK, thanks!
I'm only in the hills occasionally, but even here in Nagoya not exactly next to the sea and it would take a seriously huge tsunami to reach our apartment. (18m altitude, ~6km from water)

That was a big earthquake near the Phillipines and I think some Japanese islands got ~40cm tsunamis. That's actually big enough to be dangerous, but I don't think anyone was hurt. The biggest tsunamis they got in 2011 were ~40m high!! Hard even to imagine.

hhh · 2023-12-03 15:17:06

Yeah, those waves tower over the largest wave ever surfed (26.2 meters). 40 meters is approaching megatsunami height. I'm glad this one was nothing in comparison, and that Japan was just erring on the side of caution. Even the Philippines was spared any real wave damage.

Sure, use the longer synclient line, it shows more options.

Use Boron-aqua. We should put aqua-test in the dev forum so hopefully someone testing the RC will also have a large display and can test the theme as well.

We should also bin this thread and create a new one named "Boron Cleanup" to discuss remaining issues.

johnraff · 2023-12-04 07:06:43

Yes, this is Dobbie's thread whose carpet we are walking on in our muddy boots.

But the HiDPI theme is right on topic.
@Dobbie03, have you tried Boron-aqua-test? Did it help with your large display?

Döbbie03 · 2023-12-04 07:36:26

Please remove any muddy boots before entrance!! Seriously though no issues from me on the topic discussion etc.

Sorry chaps, I have not had a chance, I have been so busy. It's family birthday season right now, and I am all over the show with nieces, nephews and my own sons birthdays, not to mention Xmas preparation for my family and the in-laws!

I am knocking off work for the year on the 22nd, so I intend to do some testing then.

johnraff · 2023-12-04 08:39:05

^'Tis the season to be jolly or something
I've got a couple of things coming up this month...

---
On why those GTK3.2 themes are so big, found this:
https://bkhome.org/news/202204/oomox-gt … igner.html

Another criticism is that the generated theme is large, mostly because, for gtk 3.20+, it has a file 'gtk.gresource' that is about 5MB.
Hmmm, yes... with GTK2, and GTK3 prior to 3.20, you could define an engine, then just apply modifications to it -- or not even that -- in GTK2 you can just apply changes to individual widgets, modifications to the inbuilt theme. From GTK 3.20, engines are no longer supported, and CSS rules have to be provided for every widget. Absolutely every widget -- if you leave out CSS for a widget, it won't display. There doesn't seem to be any mechanism to fallback to the inbuilt theme.
...which leaves me gobsmacked.

johnraff · 2023-12-04 09:01:48

hhh wrote:

Use Boron-aqua. We should put aqua-test in the dev forum so hopefully someone testing the RC will also have a large display and can test the theme as well.

Put Boron-aqua-test (or renamed to Boron-aqua-hidpi ?) in bunsen-themes-extra?

hhh · 2023-12-05 01:17:04

^ Unless you have any objections, I'd rather generate the current themes (edit - without the extra assets) using the more recent Oomox that I used for the test theme. I prefer the more compact layout (those huge buttons are weird). Do I need to include a scrot to show what I mean?

Anyway, I think this can be done between the RC and the Release. And yes, we can put HiDP in themes-extra.

Let me know what you think, but please don't delay the RC for the themes. If you think BLOB and the systray icons are good enough, send it and let's see what the forum thinks.

Holidaze, as always.

Last edited by hhh (2023-12-05 01:31:57)

#21 2023-11-20 07:07:30

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#22 2023-11-20 07:08:17

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#23 2023-11-20 07:12:42

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#24 2023-11-20 07:28:16

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#25 2023-12-01 05:40:46

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#26 2023-12-01 05:46:29

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#27 2023-12-01 08:05:20

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#28 2023-12-01 15:13:44

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#29 2023-12-03 01:56:01

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#30 2023-12-03 02:42:10

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#31 2023-12-03 02:44:59

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#32 2023-12-03 06:21:55

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#33 2023-12-03 06:24:18

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#34 2023-12-03 06:41:15

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#35 2023-12-03 15:17:06

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#36 2023-12-04 07:06:43

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#37 2023-12-04 07:36:26

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#38 2023-12-04 08:39:05

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#39 2023-12-04 09:01:48

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

#40 2023-12-05 01:17:04

Re: A Newbies Perspective on Boron - Aesthetics more than anything

Board footer