Boron Desktop Suggestions

dmontaine · 2023-07-13 15:01:56

1) display the root menu and exit buttons in the default tint2 panel.

2) make the rather large vertical tint2 panel a bit narrower (3 or 4 pixels)
and set the panel_margin to 6 to move it slightly away from the edge
of the screen.

3) jgmenu - when showing the root menu from the menu button, create the same gap
between the tint2 panel and the root menu as exists between the root menu
and sub menus. Also set the menu background transparency to around 85 so that the
menus are not quite so white.

4) make the default conky narrower (300 pixels) and move it more to the upper right corner of the display

5) provide a 16x10 background image (ie: 1920x1200)

On lower resolution monitors (or low res vm sessions) the fat tint2 bar and wide conky are a bit overwhelming.

With the new light theme, the menu icons really are great. For the older dark themes, not so much.

Also, if you revert back to the beryllium blob the root menu overlaps the tint2 panel when the menu button is pressed.

Also bl-welcome script still bombs out if you ask for the Image Archive.

Last edited by dmontaine (2023-07-14 01:29:17)

johnraff · 2023-07-13 23:07:07

Many thanks for this careful list!

We are just about to push out a first alpha iso file, so let's keep these suggestions, along with any others we get, to consider for the following Boron alpha or beta.

DeepDayze · 2023-07-13 23:43:00

I like the "floating" taskbar..good idea!

johnraff · 2023-07-14 00:32:30

DeepDayze wrote:

I like the "floating" taskbar..good idea!

+1

and

dmontaine wrote:

4) make the default conky narrower (300 pixels) and move it more to the upper left corner of the display
On lower resolution monitors (or low res vm sessions) the fat tint2 bar and wide conky are a bit overwhelming.

I was planning to suggest the same thing for conky after testing on a small VM. But you probably meant "upper right corner"?

rbh · 2023-07-14 00:48:56

dmontaine wrote:

1) display the root menu and exit buttons in the default tint2 panel.

I think that is an error. Should not ben left out on purpose.

2) make the rather large vertical tint2 panel a bit narrower (3 or 4 pixels)

Yes, "panel_size =", could well be changed from 58 to 50 (or 30).

and set the panel_margin to 6 to move it slightly away from the edge of the screen.

I disagree on that... And think it is better for many newbie users with vertical panel.

3) jgmenu - when showing the root menu from the menu button, create the same gap between the tint2 panel and the root menu as exists between the root menu and sub menus.

I think that is impossible to set.

4) make the default conky narrower (300 pixels) and move it more to the upper left corner of the display

Yes. A gap of 15 for x and y, might be better.

5) provide a 16x10 background image (ie: 1920x1200)

You mean wallpaper? I tested to resize default Emerald_wallpaper_blTextLogo1600x1200.png, to 1920x1200. Could not notice any aesthetic deterioration... Or do you mean the grub splash image?
The /boot/grub/images/bunsen/default.png, is 1024x768. On boot, when showed for some seconds, it scales good. No need to ship a bigger splashimage.
But, some bunsen art, might be good to be able to download...

With the new light theme, the menu icons really are great. For the older dark themes, not so much.

Sorry, can not see what you mean.

Also, if you revert back to the beryllium blob the root menu overlaps the tint2 panel when the menu button is pressed.

I can not reproduce that. Tested both on my desktop and the live cd in an vm.

Also bl-welcome script still bombs out if you ask for the Image Archive.

Package bunsen-images-archives, is only available in beryllium... But I think you can download it and install from disk.
If bunsen-images-archives won't be migrated to boron, the prompt about installing it should be removed.

dmontaine · 2023-07-14 01:30:34

Yes - right - corrected

johnraff · 2023-07-14 01:33:53

rbh wrote:

If bunsen-images-archives won't be migrated to boron, the prompt about installing it should be removed.

It will be migrated, but the content has to change - checking what images are no longer available in bunsen-images and putting them in archives. That work has had a low priority but of course will be done before the official release.

unklar · 2023-07-14 07:53:37

The width of the tint2 panel is a matter of taste for me because it is user-specific. Please refer

dmontaine · 2023-07-14 19:21:51

2) make the rather large vertical tint2 panel a bit narrower (3 or 4 pixels)

Yes, "panel_size =", could well be changed from 58 to 50 (or 30).

-->> The width should be enough to show two small icons side by side and the time at the bottom, but no wider. Otherwise it is overwhelming on smaller displays

and set the panel_margin to 6 to move it slightly away from the edge of the screen.

I disagree on that... And think it is better for many newbie users with vertical panel.

-->> I have no problem with the vertical panel, The reason I suggested putting a small gap on the left hand side
of the vertical panel is that there is a gap at the top and bottom and having the same
gap on the left makes it more symetrical.

3) jgmenu - when showing the root menu from the menu button, create the same gap between the tint2 panel and the root menu as exists between the root menu and sub menus.

I think that is impossible to set.

-->> maybe. But the offset is calculated by the jjgmenu_run script procedure send_tint2_env_vars_to_jgmenu().
So it should be possible to add a few pixels to the returned x2 value. But I am not a script guru, so maybe
there is a problem I am not aware of.

4) make the default conky narrower (300 pixels) and move it more to the upper left corner of the display

Yes. A gap of 15 for x and y, might be better.

-->> In my screen shot gap_x is 60 and gap_y is 30

---

With the new light theme, the menu icons really are great. For the older dark themes, not so much.

Sorry, can not see what you mean.

-->> with the light theme and brighter menu, the icons look really good IMHO. Reverting to the the default
beryllium theme which is so sparce and colorless, adding the icons is a distraction.

Also, if you revert back to the beryllium blob the root menu overlaps the tint2 panel when the menu button is pressed.

I can not reproduce that. Tested both on my desktop and the live cd in an vm.

-->> Changing the panel height to a lesser value solved the problem for me.

Also bl-welcome script still bombs out if you ask for the Image Archive.

Package bunsen-images-archives, is only available in beryllium... But I think you can download it and install from disk.
If bunsen-images-archives won't be migrated to boron, the prompt about installing it should be removed.

-->> I believe that the script being unable to find the image archive should only display an error message, not cause
the script to fail.

Last edited by dmontaine (2023-07-14 19:25:51)

rbh · 2023-07-14 22:12:30

rbh wrote:

Yes, "panel_size =", could well be changed from 58 to 50 (or 30).

Sorry, was tired and not thinking/writing straight. I thought I had seen on tin2 config, horistal placement and 58 px high. That was what I thought about when I wrote "(or 30)".

And think it is better for many newbie users with vertical panel.

That should been horizontal panel!
Windows, mac, gnome, kde, xfce and... all have as default an horizontal panel.

johnraff · 2023-07-14 22:51:42

dmontaine wrote:

I believe that the script being unable to find the image archive should only display an error message, not cause the script to fail.

I completely agree, and in fact thought that's what was already happening. If a page action fails the script should offer to either quit or continue anyway. I'll have a look.

And thank you for all the desktop suggestions. Let's wait a bit and see what other users have to say, not to mention our graphics czar @hhh, but I agree with a number of them.

hhh · 2023-07-18 01:01:36

Been busy, sorry for the late and rushed reply!

The tint2 configs are mine and I'm not big on redundancy, hence the lack of logout and menu icons. Logout is Ctrl+x Super+x and Menu is Super. Of course, if you tend to use your mouse a lot this might not be your preference. I have no issue with them being added back. -edit- Note that with a vertical taskbar, though, you have less space so every icon added makes things look and feel mpre cramped. /edit

I'm not a fan of shrinking the panel width and then putting a margin on the left, but again that's preference.

For sure the tint2 clock should be in 24 hour time, not sure if that's been mentioned yet.

Also, I recall someone suggesting using min-width = 0 for the conky as a way to make it fit any screen, but I haven't tested it.

We'll be posting an Alpha build of our live ISO in a day or two, thanks for all the feedback!

I think @johnraff is posting promptly!

Last edited by hhh (2023-07-18 03:14:10)

dmontaine · 2023-07-18 04:14:56

I think that the new look will be an interesting change for Bunsen Labs. However, I will probably always revert back to the Beryllium blob till the end of time. For me, with a few minor tweaks, it is the best expression of an all dark build and an exceptional work of art. It fits my work habits and preferences perfectly.

One thing I really do like about Boron is the new menu layout. And, I have changed my mind. I do like icons on the menu with the Beryllium blob look and feel.

johnraff · 2023-08-02 07:01:50

johnraff wrote:

dmontaine wrote:
I believe that the script being unable to find the image archive should only display an error message, not cause the script to fail.
I completely agree, and in fact thought that's what was already happening. If a page action fails the script should offer to either quit or continue anyway. I'll have a look.

The problem was in the way the errorExit() function was used in bl-includes (provided by bunsen-comon).
If there are some details available of the error, and the user chooses to see them, then they are offered the choice to continue with the script anyway. At that point, even if the user chose to continue, the functions using errorExit() exited anyway.

That's now been fixed in an upgrade of bunsen-common, to the extent that if one of the chosen packages fails to install then while the install process itself fails, if the user chooses "continue" the script will go on to the end. In fact the only remaining page is "Finished" with a few hints about getting help etc, but it does look better if the script doesn't just error out.

EDIT: it was a mistake to make the change in bunsen-common; I've reverted that and upgraded bunsen-welcome instead.

A remaining question is what to do if user chooses to install packages A B and C, and B's installation fails. Right now the whole installation step is regarded as failing, but it might be better if each package's installation was handled separately. That does complicate error checking and messages though. Also, what if a function is set to run after installing package B? We'd need more logic to disentangle that...

Last edited by johnraff (2023-08-04 01:41:15)

johnraff · 2023-08-03 07:36:46

dmontaine wrote:

make the default conky narrower (300 pixels) and move it more to the upper right corner of the display

unklar's suggestions here seem to work.

johnraff · 2023-08-05 08:49:27

About the Boron vertical tint2:

dmontaine wrote:

make the rather large vertical tint2 panel a bit narrower (3 or 4 pixels) and set the panel_margin to 6 to move it slightly away from the edge of the screen.

DeepDayze wrote:

I like the "floating" taskbar..good idea!

dmontaine wrote:

make the rather large vertical tint2 panel a bit narrower (3 or 4 pixels)
rbh wrote:
Yes, "panel_size =", could well be changed from 58 to 50.
The width should be enough to show two small icons side by side and the time at the bottom, but no wider. Otherwise it is overwhelming on smaller displays
and set the panel_margin to 6 to move it slightly away from the edge of the screen.
rbh wrote:
I disagree on that... And think it is better for many newbie users with horizontal panel.
I have no problem with the vertical panel. The reason I suggested putting a small gap on the left hand side of the vertical panel is that there is a gap at the top and bottom and having the same gap on the left makes it more symetrical.

hhh wrote:

I'm not a fan of shrinking the panel width and then putting a margin on the left, but again that's preference.

I think it's because of the rounded corners tint2 gets from our picom settings that it's started to feel like a floating object to some of us. I tend to agree that the margin at top and bottom seems to call for a similar gap on the left. Maybe instead of setting tint2 height to 99%, go to 100% and give it a fixed pixel margin top and bottom, then set the same margin on the left? 6px? @hhh you were kind enough to suggest "preference" might have its way - would you be OK with that?

And I also felt the same as @dmontaine about the rather fat vertical bar on smaller displays. The problem goes away on more normal resolutions though, so we have to compromise. Maybe a small shrink down from 58 to 54px?

panel_size = 100% 54
panel_margin = 6 12

(vertical margin seems to need doubling)

On a small 1280x768 display:

And with 1920x1080:

An alternative could be to turn off tint2's rounded corners via picom.conf, and set the margins to zero so the panel becomes part of the desktop?

1280x768:

1920x1080:

hhh wrote:

For sure the tint2 clock should be in 24 hour time, not sure if that's been mentioned yet.

I don't think it was mentioned, but I've now put 24h clock in the default configs ready for the next bunsen-configs upgrade.

unklar · 2023-08-05 09:17:43

I must confess that I have also reached the end of what is possible with the compositor (picom) on this computer. Without picom it does not lag/jerk as with picom.

inxi -Gxxx
Graphics:
  Device-1: Intel Mobile 4 Series Integrated Graphics vendor: Lenovo
    driver: i915 v: kernel arch: Gen-5 ports: active: LVDS-1 empty: DP-1,VGA-1
    bus-ID: 00:02.0 chip-ID: 8086:2a42 class-ID: 0300
  Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 1.21.1.7 driver: X: loaded: modesetting
    unloaded: fbdev,vesa dri: crocus gpu: i915 display-ID: :0 screens: 1
  Screen-1: 0 s-res: 1680x1050 s-dpi: 96 s-size: 444x277mm (17.48x10.91")
    s-diag: 523mm (20.6")
  Monitor-1: LVDS-1 model: IBM 0x2887 res: 1680x1050 hz: 60 dpi: 129
    size: 331x207mm (13.03x8.15") diag: 390mm (15.4") modes: 1680x1050
  API: OpenGL v: 2.1 Mesa 22.3.6 renderer: Mesa Mobile Intel GM45 Express
    (CTG) direct-render: Yes

johnraff · 2023-08-05 09:29:22

^Then by all means remove picom. It's completely optional.
I'd value quick responses higher than round corners, transparency and drop shadows.

hhh · 2023-08-06 08:37:14

@johnraff, you and I are on the same page. Assume I agree with you on your decisions until I post otherwise!

Thanks for your continued hard work. Just so you know, GNOME is gone on my system and Openbox is my default window manager, and it would never have happened without all the BL tools (jgmenu, conky restart, tint2 restart, picom restart, etc...) It really feels like a slick desktop environment these days, using a third less RAM than GNOME, but keeping all the functionality and eyecandy.

Except for changing font settings in at least five places (GTK, Openbox, Conky, tint2, jgmenu), but that's one for Carbon!

DeepDayze · 2023-08-06 15:13:17

Sorry if I am hijacking this thread but one thing is how can you turn off rounded corners for maximized windows? Otherwise digging the rounded XP-style window corners.

Last edited by DeepDayze (2023-08-06 15:13:50)

#1 2023-07-13 15:01:56

Boron Desktop Suggestions

#2 2023-07-13 23:07:07

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#3 2023-07-13 23:43:00

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#4 2023-07-14 00:32:30

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#5 2023-07-14 00:48:56

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#6 2023-07-14 01:30:34

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#7 2023-07-14 01:33:53

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#8 2023-07-14 07:53:37

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#9 2023-07-14 19:21:51

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#10 2023-07-14 22:12:30

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#11 2023-07-14 22:51:42

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#12 2023-07-18 01:01:36

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#13 2023-07-18 04:14:56

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#14 2023-08-02 07:01:50

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#15 2023-08-03 07:36:46

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#16 2023-08-05 08:49:27

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#17 2023-08-05 09:17:43

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#18 2023-08-05 09:29:22

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#19 2023-08-06 08:37:14

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

#20 2023-08-06 15:13:17

Re: Boron Desktop Suggestions

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