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#1 2019-01-06 19:36:25

Bearded_Blunder
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[NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

I noticed that the "software update" carried out in bl-welcome appears not to run apt autoremove as apt suggets, Today on a fresh install I exited after the initial update & ran the command manually & there was stuff it would remove.

I know it'll show up next time someone updates, still, I was curious if it was intentional or an oversight.

Last edited by earlybird (2019-01-07 13:39:15)


Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall not be disappointed...
If there's an obscure or silly way to break it, but you don't know what.. Just ask me

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#2 2019-01-07 05:18:32

johnraff
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Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

"autoremove" is only a suggestion. It would be overbearing of the script to do it without asking first, which would complicate the flow for a trivial (IMO) gain in saved disk space, which the user would have plenty of opportunity to correct on future apt-get runs.

So, intentional.


John
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#3 2019-01-08 02:26:26

Bearded_Blunder
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Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

Well it was a fair question, and intentional is fine, "overbearing" is opinion.. compared to the forced reboots and forced in-place upgrades & software removals due to being "incompatible" (often with no warning) that Microsoft subject users to, it would be pretty minor, but I certainly respect the decision.


Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall not be disappointed...
If there's an obscure or silly way to break it, but you don't know what.. Just ask me

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#4 2019-01-08 17:50:12

hhh
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Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

Any list of packages marked for autoremoval needs to be looked over by the user before removal, autoremove is not infallible and has the potential to cripple a system. Having the welcome script run autoremove would still require the user to choose "Y" to run, but IMO having it in the script would suggest to a new user that it is also automatically "safe" to run.

I'm not seeing much Debian documentation on apt --purge autoremove, but I've experienced the consequences of running it blindly (probably while running sid).

Debian Wiki wrote:

    Autoremove

autoremove is used to remove packages that were automatically installed to satisfy dependencies for other packages and are now no longer needed as dependencies changed or the package(s) needing them were removed in the meantime. The command for autoremove is simple as:

$ sudo apt autoremove

It can also be issued while removing the package like this: (hhh edit- in this case the package clang, and of course foo in the next example... replace with the package you want to remove/mark)

$ sudo apt remove clang --auto-remove

You should check that the list does not include applications you have grown to like even though they were once installed just as a dependency of another package. You can mark such a package as manually installed by using "sudo apt-mark auto/manual foo". Packages which you have installed explicitly/directly via install are also never proposed for automatic removal.

https://wiki.debian.org/DebianPackageManagement

https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debi … 02.en.html

-hhh edit-

https://forums.bunsenlabs.org/viewtopic.php?id=4872

Last edited by hhh (2019-01-10 00:48:57)

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#5 2019-01-10 06:15:22

ohnonot
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Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

^ my experience is, if you ALWAYS run autoremove (after upgrades or removals), it won't ever break your system.

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#6 2019-01-10 06:24:59

ohnonot
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Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

hhh wrote:

I'd agree if I was running stable

i never tried anything else on debian, so i guess that's a valid argument.

fwiw, i run the equivalent of that on my archlinux system with eqyual frequency.

Last edited by ohnonot (2019-01-10 06:25:31)

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#7 2019-01-10 06:28:48

hhh
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Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

hhh wrote:

^ I'd agree if I was running stable, though I'd still be vigilant.

For a new user, I wouldn't even recommend using it, unless they need a super lean system. Some libraries and an orphaned app or twelve? Better that than breaking your OS because you didn't know what cpp-8 was.

I deleted this post, it goes 2 up. Oops.

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#8 2019-01-10 08:48:42

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 5,101
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Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

There have certainly been cases in the past when "autoremove" offered to gut a person's system, and not only here on BL. But I think it's better now. Handling of metapackages has improved, and bl-welcome is more careful too.

Still, I'd agree with hhh that a human ought to run an eye over the list before clicking yes.


John
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( a boring Japan blog , Japan Links, idle twitterings  and GitStuff )
In case you forget, the rules.

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#9 2019-01-10 11:50:08

Bearded_Blunder
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Posts: 730

Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

Well then, short of exposing the list somehow and giving some yes/no option, I think you were correct to leave it till someone updates manually.  Looking the list over does give you the chance to

apt-mark manual package

after all, assuming you know you can.. I'm still a relative n00b & learning stuffs wink


Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall not be disappointed...
If there's an obscure or silly way to break it, but you don't know what.. Just ask me

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#10 2019-01-11 01:14:59

hhh
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Re: [NOTABUG] Bug or intentional - bl-welcome not offering autoremove

^We all are! Cheers.

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