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#1 2017-04-06 05:15:37

Temetka
Member
From: Sol System, Western Spiral Arm
Registered: 2015-10-14
Posts: 545

And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Check it:

https://arstechnica.com/information-tec … next-year/

I never liked Unity. Don't really care for Gnome 3 either.

My fav was Gnome 2.3. or KDE 3. Loved 'em both.

That being said, OpenBox is where it's at for me at this point in time. Anyway just thought I'd toss a link to the article out there and see what you guys think of this.


The meaning of life is to just be alive. It is so plain and so obvious
    and so simple. And yet everybody rushes aroound in a great panic
             as if it were necessary to achieve something beyond themselves.
                                                                                                             - Alan Watts

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#2 2017-04-06 06:25:09

cpoakes
Member
Registered: 2016-12-02
Posts: 108

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

While I didn't like Unity, I was glad for the variation and experiments with user interfaces. Thank goodness for the death of convergence. The optimal interface for a desktop has little in common with the optimal interface for a phone.

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#3 2017-04-06 07:10:12

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 8,759
Website

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Does this mean that Ubuntu have given up on Mir as well?

EDIT: yes, it does, that's in the linked article.

Snaps will be gone soon too, I suppose (flatpaks ftw!)  devil

Last edited by Head_on_a_Stick (2017-04-06 07:11:30)


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#4 2017-04-06 07:46:55

brontosaurusrex
Middle Office
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 1,817
Website

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Not for real.

Last edited by brontosaurusrex (2017-04-06 07:47:26)

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#5 2017-04-06 13:21:32

harbardthesloth
Member
Registered: 2017-03-23
Posts: 11

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

brontosaurusrex wrote:

Post made me chuckle.  Then I started reading the rest of the blog.  I just setup a vanilla debian vmbox with the debian netinstall disc.  I feel that I am going to have to slice me off a copy of that and have a go with the postbang configs.  Good Stuff!!!  Also I will not be shedding any tears for Unity.  It did its job but I always got this restrictive feel, even if I had that tweak tool installed.  In all honesty I have not used Gnome 3 much.  But now that Mark & co have seen the Wayland (sorry I had to) I poked around for some sort article or video on the current state of Gnome 3.x + Wayland and I found this demo vid on youtube it looks like Wayland + Gnome 3.24 (which is in beta?) + Proprietary Nvidia drivers, it looks like what does work, works rather smoothly.  If you have epilepsy, don't watch the video though.  Some real issues crop up when the poster tries using gtk2, its not pretty.  I am tempted, when I get home, upgrade my 16.10 box to 17.04 rc that comes out today to see what if I can get a Gnome 3 session with Wayland running.  Any how Bon voyage Unity.


I may be slow, but I have the best of intentions.

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#6 2017-04-06 14:42:08

Sector11
The Tpyo Knig Mod
From: 77345 ¡#
Registered: 2015-08-20
Posts: 5,528

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Temetka wrote:

{snip snip} Don't really care for Gnome 3 either.

My fav was Gnome 2.3 {snip snip}

That being said, OpenBox is where it's at for me at this point in time. {snip snip}

I concur on these three points as well. wink


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#7 2017-04-06 14:47:46

Sector11
The Tpyo Knig Mod
From: 77345 ¡#
Registered: 2015-08-20
Posts: 5,528

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

brontosaurusrex wrote:

bronto - That's the best little read in a long time.  Thanks.

chuckled my way through it....


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#8 2017-04-06 16:57:04

hhh
Meep!
Registered: 2015-09-17
Posts: 8,347
Website

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

harbardthesloth wrote:

Gnome 3.24 (which is in beta?)

No, it's been released.
https://www.gnome.org/news/2017/03/gnome-3-24-released/
https://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop … 00083.html

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#9 2017-04-07 07:19:17

ohnonot
...again
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 3,917
Website

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

Does this mean that Ubuntu have given up on Mir as well?

EDIT: yes, it does, that's in the linked article.

Snaps will be gone soon too, I suppose (flatpaks ftw!)  devil

more good news it seems.
what's snaps?

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#10 2017-04-07 08:39:38

vasa1
Member
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 176

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

AFAIK, snaps won't "be gone soon".

http://askubuntu.com/questions/866511/d … ers/866600


Using the Openbox (3.5.2) session of Lubuntu 14.04 LTS but very interested in BL :)

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#11 2017-04-07 09:43:02

twoion
ほやほや
Registered: 2015-08-10
Posts: 2,485

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

So Canonical wants to stop burning money on moneysink developments like Ubuntu Phone, Mir et al. and focus more on the server/cloud markets. They have some very nice stuff (lxc, lxd, good server release model) to work with so let's see how competing directly with RedHat turns out for them.


A silent kite against the blue, blue sky

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#12 2017-04-07 14:35:52

Sector11
The Tpyo Knig Mod
From: 77345 ¡#
Registered: 2015-08-20
Posts: 5,528

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

 07 Apr 17 @ 11:33:44 ~
  $ sho snap
aptitude show filename
Package: snap                            
State: not installed
Version: 2013-11-29-1
Priority: extra
Section: science
Maintainer: Debian Med Packaging Team <debian-med-packaging@lists.alioth.debian.org>
Architecture: amd64
Uncompressed Size: 2,718 k
Depends: libc6 (>= 2.14)
Conflicts: snap
Description: location of genes from DNA sequence with hidden markov model
 SNAP is a general purpose gene finding program suitable for both eukaryotic and prokaryotic genomes. SNAP is an acroynm for Semi-HMM-based
 Nucleic Acid Parser.
Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/iankorf/

 
 07 Apr 17 @ 11:33:59 ~
  $ 

I'm guessing that's not the 'snap' they are talking about.


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#13 2017-04-07 16:36:30

vasa1
Member
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 176

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Only if there's a related acronym for flatpak wink

Snaps will be gone soon too, I suppose (flatpaks ftw!)


Using the Openbox (3.5.2) session of Lubuntu 14.04 LTS but very interested in BL :)

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#14 2017-04-07 16:43:58

Horizon_Brave
Operating System: Linux-Nettrix
Registered: 2015-10-18
Posts: 1,473

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

twoion wrote:

So Canonical wants to stop burning money on moneysink developments like Ubuntu Phone, Mir et al. and focus more on the server/cloud markets. They have some very nice stuff (lxc, lxd, good server release model) to work with so let's see how competing directly with RedHat turns out for them.


That's true about Redhat having the near lions share in terms of enterprise "open" (note the quotes)  software platform... Is there really room for two linux platforms on the enterprise. I work for Nokia, and we partner with lots of Telco/ISP like Verizon and AT&T and all of their platforms and servers run Redhat already...  The amount of work required just to update to a new version of redhat is a ton... I can't imagine the crap ton of litagation that would be needed to switch to an entire other OS.  I think Canonical wouldn't be catering to the already established RedHat Enterprise markets... Maybe smaller businesses, start ups..?


"I have not failed, I have found 10,000 ways that will not work" -Edison

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#15 2017-04-07 16:54:10

twoion
ほやほや
Registered: 2015-08-10
Posts: 2,485

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Horizon_Brave wrote:
twoion wrote:

So Canonical wants to stop burning money on moneysink developments like Ubuntu Phone, Mir et al. and focus more on the server/cloud markets. They have some very nice stuff (lxc, lxd, good server release model) to work with so let's see how competing directly with RedHat turns out for them.


That's true about Redhat having the near lions share in terms of enterprise "open" (note the quotes)  software platform... Is there really room for two linux platforms on the enterprise. I work for Nokia, and we partner with lots of Telco/ISP like Verizon and AT&T and all of their platforms and servers run Redhat already...  The amount of work required just to update to a new version of redhat is a ton... I can't imagine the crap ton of litagation that would be needed to switch to an entire other OS.  I think Canonical wouldn't be catering to the already established RedHat Enterprise markets... Maybe smaller businesses, start ups..?

I agree that organizations relying on RHEL won't most likely budge because of both the huge technical and bureaucratic effort to migrate. Even being cheaper won't make much of a difference because as Ubuntu, a huge chunk of RHEL is available for free if needed (CentOS) and RHEL has a huge advantage in quality when it comes to extent and thoroughness of documentation (very good, even if most of it is written by some Indian guys).


A silent kite against the blue, blue sky

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#16 2017-04-07 17:17:17

Horizon_Brave
Operating System: Linux-Nettrix
Registered: 2015-10-18
Posts: 1,473

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

twoion wrote:
Horizon_Brave wrote:
twoion wrote:

So Canonical wants to stop burning money on moneysink developments like Ubuntu Phone, Mir et al. and focus more on the server/cloud markets. They have some very nice stuff (lxc, lxd, good server release model) to work with so let's see how competing directly with RedHat turns out for them.


That's true about Redhat having the near lions share in terms of enterprise "open" (note the quotes)  software platform... Is there really room for two linux platforms on the enterprise. I work for Nokia, and we partner with lots of Telco/ISP like Verizon and AT&T and all of their platforms and servers run Redhat already...  The amount of work required just to update to a new version of redhat is a ton... I can't imagine the crap ton of litagation that would be needed to switch to an entire other OS.  I think Canonical wouldn't be catering to the already established RedHat Enterprise markets... Maybe smaller businesses, start ups..?

I agree that organizations relying on RHEL won't most likely budge because of both the huge technical and bureaucratic effort to migrate. Even being cheaper won't make much of a difference because as Ubuntu, a huge chunk of RHEL is available for free if needed (CentOS) and RHEL has a huge advantage in quality when it comes to extent and thoroughness of documentation (very good, even if most of it is written by some Indian guys).

Haha some Indian guys... well in their defense I work with some indian guys and the developers and higher tier guys actually know a ton. (way way more than I do)

Also as for cost, I'm not sure how it works but I think you may for a subscription for a lot of support services so that can add up over time... But again, big enterprises like the saftey nets and can absorb those costs. So yea I don't see Canonical pushing into this market very successfully...


"I have not failed, I have found 10,000 ways that will not work" -Edison

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#17 2017-04-07 19:36:55

ohnonot
...again
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 3,917
Website

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

vasa1 wrote:

that answers my question (i was too lazy to search...).
thanks!

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#18 2017-04-09 21:52:02

BLizgreat!
Resident Babbler - vll!
Registered: 2015-10-03
Posts: 1,018

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Not surprised about this, though they stepped on their dink, when they force fed Unity.

Never really got the unity exodus, users could've removed unity, installed xyz and gotten on with lives, shrugs.

One of several reasons I won't run ubuntu and don't run LM buntu based either anymore. Lmde is uber over config'ed too. Somebody can customize all hades out of buntu-Mint, add-remove whatever but it's more of a pita, those distros clearly have a target userbase though. Just want a works ootb drop in gnu/nix for whichever version of window$.

Way easier to install BL or tons of others and start with a minimal setup to tweak. Goodbye unity. Sorry for semi-offtopic fellow nixers. smile

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2017-04-09 21:54:02)

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#19 2017-04-10 05:51:54

ohnonot
...again
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 3,917
Website

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

but that's precisely the point.
ubuntu is geared towards people who don't change defaults.
who want things to Just Work, thankyouverymuch, and look Sexy the moment they "open the box".
Terminal is cool only when you want to show off your fortune-mod ponies or whatever.
Edit config files? What an insult! There must be a gui for that; I'm not from the stone ages!

the whole unity experience is woven around that.
never tried it, but my guess is that changing desktops would be challenging even for advanced users, because of the way ubuntu is branded & designed from early booting.

all that said, gnome3 is hardly better.
this article shows it quite well (esp. when clicking on all the links) - all this has been going on for quite a long time.
to go with the old analogy of "Linux is like a box of LEGOs" - canonical are definitely using a lot of glue to avoid tweaking.

edit:
wow! i can't believe that my reply is actually longer than babblemeister's post!

Last edited by ohnonot (2017-04-10 05:54:25)

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#20 2017-04-10 06:50:08

brontosaurusrex
Middle Office
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 1,817
Website

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

@ohnonot: agreed, with gnome they will just repeat the mistake, but at least they don't have to deal with it directly I guess. So called mobile convergence just didn't work (not saying it could not).

P.s. What was that formula for people walking from point a to b? (That could be applied to desktop with mouse as well)

Last edited by brontosaurusrex (2017-04-10 08:46:02)

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#21 2017-04-10 07:27:23

BLizgreat!
Resident Babbler - vll!
Registered: 2015-10-03
Posts: 1,018

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Lmao Ohnonot, the Baconator demonstrated a fairly detailed example of doing a minimal ubuntu net-install in the #! forum. Was trademark MB, guy never fails to impress me.

So provided that option is still around, shouldn't be difficult at all for any half decent nixers. Agree with you ootb, it'd likely be much more annoying but why would anyone wanna start with buntu ? smile

Also agree about mostly only hearing bad things about gnome3. This really is all academic for me, not ever planning on joining their userbase w so many better options in the Nixverse to be had. smile

Vll!

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#22 2017-04-10 08:54:27

iMBeCil
WAAAT?
From: Edrychwch o'ch cwmpas
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 643

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

I must say that - in retrospect - I'm extremely satisfied with Ubuntu Unity. It made me search for another distro ... the search with the very very happy ending ... ending/landing on #!. It was just the push I needed ...

THANK YOU UNITY/UBUNTU! Seriously.


Postpone all your duties; if you die, you won't have to do them ..

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#23 2017-04-10 14:19:40

ohnonot
...again
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 3,917
Website

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

idea: what will happen to unity now? will it "revert" to a "normal" FOSS project? Could be a good thing...

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#24 2017-04-10 16:44:01

Sector11
The Tpyo Knig Mod
From: 77345 ¡#
Registered: 2015-08-20
Posts: 5,528

Re: And so the sun set on Ubuntu with Unity as they go back to Gnome

Ubuntu 7.04 (Gome 2) gave me my first taste of Linux.  Ubu 8.04's bloat slowed my P-III down just like Windows did so I tried Xubuntu 8.04 and it wasn't much better.  Led me to looking around and just like iMBeCil I landed in/on/with #!.

Did some distro hopping, but never took #! off my "default grub boot" spot.  Even with my side trip to another Distro, #! was always here (still is - following Wheezy now).    Later I recall reading posts that said Xubuntu was a perfect example of how NOT to implement Xfce4 because of Ubu's bloat. Maybe just someones opinion but it certainly was sloooow.

As for Unity - never used it, and Gnome 3, I'm like BLwbg, heard bad things and have no intention of ever using it.

If OpenBox and or Fluxbox don't make it to Wayland maybe "Orbital" will be where I go.

Orbital     Stacking     Orbital is a Wayland compositor and shell, using Qt5 and Weston. The goal of the project is to build a simple yet flexible and good looking Wayland desktop. It is not a full fledged DE but rather the analogue of a WM in the X11 world, such as Awesome or Fluxbox.

Or maybe as HoaS mentioned in another post; sway


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