Changing the window border size

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-01 22:38:47

Hi. Sorry for the FAQ. I have searched high and low for this: the forums, and in every config file and menu option I could find under "Preferences".

This is on a new BL default install from a couple of weeks ago.
Linux ludicrous 3.16.0-4-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 3.16.7-ckt20-1+deb8u3 (2016-01-17) x86_64 GNU/Linux

I love the BL default appearance. I chose the "Blue" appearance tweak, and that is all. But I just want a couple of more pixels on my windows to grab and resize. Yes I know, you have this great minimalist appearance. I just cannot find how to control this. Every search leads me toward Conky. I don't care about Conky! Or tint2! lol I just want more than hair-line window borders! :-)

Help??

damo · 2016-03-01 22:50:19

Help -> Openbox -> Openbox Website -> Openbox Documentation

Browser -> Search engine -> "openbox window border size"

You are looking to change "border.Width: 1" in the themerc file of the Openbox theme you are using.
In a default install this will be in `/usr/share/themes/<theme name>/openbox-3/themerc`.

Personally I copy an entire theme directory to ~/.themes (create it if it doesn't exist) and edit that - it is the one chosen by obconfig.

After editing, re-choose the theme in obconfig (Menu -> Preferences -> Openbox -> GUI Config Tool), and Apply

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-01 23:04:38

Okay so it IS Openbox that controls this!? I already went through every openbox setting I could find. But I have to copy something new from the system files, put it in my .themes directory (which exists but is empty), and then edit that file? This isn't in the GUI Appearance editor by default. :-/

This stuff may seem obvious for you developers, and I'm a developer myself. But for the rest of us, with compositor, conky, tint2, openbox, and more, it's not that obvious where to find something to do with the overall desktop appearance. I thought surely I was warm, with Prefs -> Openbox -> rc.xml, but I carefully combed through that entire file. Nothing.

Do I get to whine, yet, about this setting being just a little obscure, for something so obviously big and important? Maybe just important to me, I guess! :-)

Thanks!

Eraph · 2016-03-01 23:34:42

Nah, it's not just you mate. I'm still getting the hang of what's responsible for what... maybe a quick primer on what each component is and how to configure it by UI and editing config files would be handy. Y'know, for us plebs who have come from more point-and-click friendly OSes

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-01 23:37:06

Unfortunately, now, none of this matters much, because BL has started randomly hard-crashing on me every 1-2 hours of actual use. I have no idea what I might have done to provoke this. All I'm running is Iceweasel and Terminator. Right now I'm just hoping it stays up long enough for me to post this. Then I'm rebooting into Windows so I can get some work done. :-( :-( :-(

damo · 2016-03-01 23:37:40

EDIT: post rendered pointless by an ungrateful OP. Enjoy your WinBloat

DivingPhoenix wrote:

Okay so it IS Openbox that controls this!? I already went through every openbox setting I could find. But I have to copy something new from the system files, put it in my .themes directory (which exists but is empty), and then edit that file? This isn't in the GUI Appearance editor by default. :-/

The Appearance editor (lxappearance) doesn't deal with Openbox, but with gtk, icons etc. The window manager settings are in the Openbox section of the menu, but the individual theme settings are in the theme's `themerc` file. You can edit the system one if you want, but IMO it is safer to copy it to your `$USER/.themes` location, and edit that version - (1) you don't need to be root, (2) if you mess it up you still have the original.

This stuff may seem obvious for you developers, and I'm a developer myself. But for the rest of us, with compositor, conky, tint2, openbox, and more, it's not that obvious where to find something to do with the overall desktop appearance. I thought surely I was warm, with Prefs -> Openbox -> rc.xml, but I carefully combed through that entire file. Nothing.
Do I get to whine, yet, about this setting being just a little obscure, for something so obviously big and important? Maybe just important to me, I guess! :-)
Thanks!

BunsenLabs (= Debian Stable + Openbox) aims to be as lightweight as possible, but still having a usable GUI and components. A consequence of this is that "with compositor, conky, tint2, openbox, and more", most configuration will be by editing textfiles.

Which is easier - having a huge gui application with all the possible theme settings, or a simple textfile with simple-to-understand (in this case) settings? You choose. And pick your distro accordingly.

Probably best not to whine too much, since that's the way BL works I guess it is an individual thing - I'm perfectly OK (and prefer) textfile configuration for the GUI elements, but wish there were gui's for all the system configurations!

To help users new to this approach, the main menu has extensive links to wikis, manpages etc. Obviously you can also ask here as well, but as I hinted before, a websearch could have brought you straight to the answer (assuming window configs are set by the window manager ). The Crunchbang forums are still a fantastic resource for answers BTW.

Last edited by damo (2016-03-01 23:39:23)

damo · 2016-03-01 23:42:20

Eraph wrote:

Nah, it's not just you mate. I'm still getting the hang of what's responsible for what... maybe a quick primer on what each component is and how to configure it by UI and editing config files would be handy. Y'know, for us plebs who have come from more point-and-click friendly OSes

Have you seen the Help section in the menu? It pretty much covers all the default desktop stuff.

Eraph · 2016-03-01 23:43:59

damo wrote:

Eraph wrote:
Nah, it's not just you mate. I'm still getting the hang of what's responsible for what... maybe a quick primer on what each component is and how to configure it by UI and editing config files would be handy. Y'know, for us plebs who have come from more point-and-click friendly OSes
Have you seen the Help section in the menu? It pretty much covers all the default desktop stuff.

I will give it a look.

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-02 00:14:37

damo wrote:

EDIT: post rendered pointless by an ungrateful OP. Enjoy your WinBloat

Not ungrateful! And did you see the number of frownie faces I put after "Windows"?? Sheesh!

I am perfectly happy editing .rc text files. I like the Crunchbang, now Bunsen, experience. It reminds me of TWM from my old SunOS days. The configurable menus, lightweight appearance ... all good here. I'm even okay re-sizing windows from the upper-left menu option, rather than the 99% of people who rely/assume on window borders/corners. I just wanted to know where this simple setting was.

And I DID go searching, as I said, and if you do the same, you will find like I did: if you don't already know that the secret key is "openbox" in your search, you will never find it. All roads lead to Conky. I even added "-conky" to take out those results. Got nowhere close to this answer.

You can say "RTFM" all you want. Without knowing what manual to read, though, that's just not fair. This is not something you should expect users to spend hours reading manuals to find. And, sorry, falling back to some bloated GUI configurator is a cop-out. I don't need that either.

My point remains: This particular desktop appearance setting (hey search engine! WINDOW BORDER WIDTH!) is very elusive, compared to all the rest. I'm surprised to get so much pushback on this. How about one more default setting file under the desktop menu->prefs? "Root edit .themerc"? Something?

With thanks,
Grateful user,
DP

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-02 00:16:54

Now I really wish I knew why BL was crashing. :-((( Now it just died in the middle of "apt-get upgrade", so that's going to get ugly. *Sigh* back to a re-install, and then I won't go touching any setting defaults! 1-pixel window border? Okay! You win! Just don't crash! (RME)

damo · 2016-03-02 00:27:21

^ Noted, thanks. Let's put it down to communication errors {) (BTW the "frownies" didn't come across as emoticons. And I still would have misinterpreted!)

How about one more default setting file under the desktop menu->prefs? "Root edit .themerc"? Something?

But where would it stop? Each user has a different requirement. Would it also need an explanation of what `themerc` is? And editing it as root affects all users, which may be what you want, but others might not.

This what the forums and manuals/wikis are for imo.

All I can say is that users do have to read the manual, which is why I made the Help menu as comprehensive as reasonable. Urukrama's site is a very readable and excellent resource for Openbox btw, which explains most all about it.

I've used OB almost exclusively on my own machines for 8years, but the nooks and crannies still surprise (and gratify) me. It is such a lovely configurable WM

damo · 2016-03-02 00:30:44

DivingPhoenix wrote:

Now I really wish I knew why BL was crashing. :-((( Now it just died in the middle of "apt-get upgrade", so that's going to get ugly. *Sigh* back to a re-install, and then I won't go touching any setting defaults! 1-pixel window border? Okay! You win! Just don't crash! (RME)

Can I suggest you open a new thread about this? Try to provide as much info as possible - hardware, which iso, how did you install, any logfiles/error messages etc.
(It sounds like a memory issue. Full disk? Dodgy RAM hardware? Do a memory test)

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-02 00:41:00

damo wrote:

But where would it stop? Each user has a different requirement. Would it also need an explanation of what `themerc` is? And editing it as root affects all users, which may be what you want, but others might not.

OKay, then how about a comment at the top of rc.xml? "OTHER WINDOW SETTINGS LIKE BORDERS AND A MILLION COLOR SETTINGS CAN BE FOUND *HERE*"

damo wrote:

All I can say is that users do have to read the manual, which is why I made the Help menu as comprehensive as reasonable. Urukrama's site is a very readable and excellent resource for Openbox btw, which explains most all about it.

Again: Awesome. IF you already know that Openbox is where you need to start. I really think you are so entrenched in this project, you couldn't possibly imagine NOT knowing that. Sorry! DUmbo here!

^There, graphical smileys! Happy?

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-02 00:44:41

damo wrote:

DivingPhoenix wrote:
Now I really wish I knew why BL was crashing. :-((( Now it just died in the middle of "apt-get upgrade", so that's going to get ugly. *Sigh* back to a re-install, and then I won't go touching any setting defaults! 1-pixel window border? Okay! You win! Just don't crash! (RME)
Can I suggest you open a new thread about this? Try to provide as much info as possible - hardware, which iso, how did you install, any logfiles/error messages etc.
(It sounds like a memory issue. Full disk? Dodgy RAM hardware? Do a memory test)

Yeah, except I'm now typing at you on the same machine, under THAT OTHER operating system, with more stuff running at once, and everything is fine. Thanks and yeah I'll open another thread if I feel the energy. This crash is so sudden, yes I would guess a hardware problem at first, too. I bet there's no logs. It's just, alive one second, dead the next. Poof.

tknomanzr · 2016-03-02 00:47:17

So, no hard loak, the system is just shutting down? That is usually a thermal issue. Linux will shut you down hard if your cpu hits the critical threshold for temperature.

Last edited by tknomanzr (2016-03-02 00:47:27)

damo · 2016-03-02 00:55:12

To be fair, we do try. The home page of Bunsenlabs has

...Pre-configured Openbox window manager with tint2 panel and conky system monitor

I take your point that new users may find it hard to find their way around, but if you don't know that windows are managed by Openbox, in an Openbox distro, there isn't much more we can do I think.

How many places should help info be put to cover all the user edge-cases? The decision was made that having a main menu item labelled "Help" should be adequate for most users.

Eraph · 2016-03-02 00:57:38

For me, there's the matter of Openbox vs Compositor. There are two menu items. I have a suspicion of what the relationship might be but I'm not totally clear. Bear in mind I'm still getting my head around the difference between Window Manager and Desktop Environment...

Last edited by Eraph (2016-03-02 00:58:20)

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-02 01:04:36

damo wrote:

To be fair, we do try. The home page of Bunsenlabs has
...Pre-configured Openbox window manager with tint2 panel and conky system monitor
I take your point that new users may find it hard to find their way around, but if you don't know that windows are managed by Openbox, in an Openbox distro, there isn't much more we can do I think.
How many places should help info be put to cover all the user edge-cases? The decision was made that having a main menu item labelled "Help" should be adequate for most users.

Fair enough and I did start with Openbox settings. I went through every setting file I could find, under your very nice and convenient right-click menu on the desktop. Openbox, Preferences, Settings, GUI, Appearances, and yes Help, and I searched the forums, and the web, as I said ... we are at an impasse. Sorry, I tried, failed, and resorted to here. Thanks for the info.

damo · 2016-03-02 01:07:05

Eraph wrote:

For me, there's the matter of Openbox vs Compositor. There are two menu items. I have a suspicion of what the relationship might be but I'm not totally clear. Bear in mind I'm still getting my head around the difference between Window Manager and Desktop Environment...

In a terminal, look at the manpages for concise descriptions

man openbox
man compton

Openbox manages windows, placement, snapping etc; compton (the compositor BL uses) deals with transparency and effects basically.
(Aside: maybe we should put `man openbox` in the menu as well)

DivingPhoenix · 2016-03-02 01:07:33

tknomanzr wrote:

So, no hard loak, the system is just shutting down? That is usually a thermal issue. Linux will shut you down hard if your cpu hits the critical threshold for temperature.

I will go back and watch again. One thing I love about your default setup, with Conky, is that it shows the current MHZ and Temp! I am pretty sure the CPU was calm. And RAM hasn't changed or thrown any errors, in months. I'll turn on RAM check and "slow boot" in the BIOS anyway. And yes I'll take this to another topic. Thanks for the idea here though.

#1 2016-03-01 22:38:47

Changing the window border size

#2 2016-03-01 22:50:19

Re: Changing the window border size

#3 2016-03-01 23:04:38

Re: Changing the window border size

#4 2016-03-01 23:34:42

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#5 2016-03-01 23:37:06

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#6 2016-03-01 23:37:40

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#7 2016-03-01 23:42:20

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#8 2016-03-01 23:43:59

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#9 2016-03-02 00:14:37

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#11 2016-03-02 00:27:21

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