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#876 2020-01-29 18:41:42

manyroads
Member
From: around here, somewhere
Registered: 2019-04-16
Posts: 53
Website

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

Yes, please move the post to the appropriate location.


Pax vobiscum,
Mark Rabideau (manyroads)
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong."    ---H. L. Mencken
Reg. Linux User #449130

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#877 2020-02-14 17:43:48

THX1138
Member
Registered: 2019-01-14
Posts: 205

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

Hope you guys remember me hahahah. I've been busy
with work and with updating my knowledge of unix/linux

On the subject of distro hopping I am running
Bunsenlabs on one machine at the moment
but I have been really impressed with Void Linux
I really do love Bunsenlabs, it's not just the actual distro
It's the knowledge and the dedication you guys have.
When I really need to know something all roads for me
lead back to this forum.

Anyway, I can tell you that, to be honest I'm sort of on the side
of people who mistrust systemd and so have been messing with pretty much EVERY
non-systemd linux distro and unix variant possible
From MX Linux to openindiana and everything inbetween
I doubt you could name a non-systemd distro I have not now tried
They have their faults, it's true
Some are too complex to install, others are lacking a decent knowledge base
some lack a decent package manager
I am often tempted to just accept systemd is here to stay
I know it prolly wont happen but my greatest hope is that you guys get a
non-systemd version of Bunsenlabs going, though I think I read another thread
where you said it would likely never happen

ANYWAY I just thought I'd say that the two best non-systemd OS's I found were Illumos openindiana and Void Linux. I've really done my research on non-systemd OS's to the extent of my limited knowledge and needs

Last edited by THX1138 (2020-02-14 18:51:34)


The telephone is an antiquity - you never know who is calling, there is no image, it is an outmoded product which constantly disrupts work (Ralf Hutter (Kraftwerk)) ps: my wife knows how much I dislike being disrupted at Work - Ralf Hutter hit the nail on the head there

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#878 2020-02-14 21:04:30

Bridouz
Member
From: France, countryside
Registered: 2019-08-15
Posts: 45
Website

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

I've too been messing with non-systemd distributions.

  • Void is really nice

  • Alpine is very minimal and is becoming really great for desktop use

  • I've also tried Kiss Linux, Dylan Araps is a very talented and dedicated guy. But compilation id a very time-consuming process and does not give many performance improvements


    And in the end I came back on Debian/BunsenLabs. Stable is really nice for me. To have an OS which does not change and works without too many tweaks is a must-have. Too much stuff to do in Life 1.0.

Last edited by Bridouz (2020-02-14 21:04:47)

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#879 2020-02-15 17:55:42

Nili
Member
From: $HOME/♫♪
Registered: 2015-09-30
Posts: 929
Website

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

When i started my journey on Linux systemd it hadn't yet infected major distros like Arch, Debian or even Fedora for end-users.

While i was in #! (Waldorf) also on testing (Janice) felt the first systemd transitions, at first i didn't accept it, but i got used to it on my daily tasks.
Since Janice never saw the light of day unfortunately. I was able to move on Debian Jessie, thanks to users/tutorial from #! forum managed to install my first custom NETINST.

So, I learned to survive and live with systemd, For two years i used systemd. In the meantime, time after time i saw that another system was emerging. That was Dev1, while i had an eye there, one day decided to give it a try. At first I liked the fact that the ISO was only 220MB. I'm really obsessed with distro size, less the better. Once i installed Dev1 My first impression was. Well that's Debian Wheezy or Crunchbang Waldorf that i was used to have fun.
I installed it and from that day one of my desktops is with it. However, sometimes i go to Install Debian like 10.3 i did few days ago, however already i can't find myself there anymore for many reasons.

systemd has brought a lot of benefits and facilities to users or mostly new users, at the same time has separated some others because of it's policies or the other standarts she wants to decide to made.

The reason i don't use BunsenLabs is because of systemd sorry, but i was part of this forum for many years. I have seen many hours of works and adjusts, my dear BL friends have done over the years, despite not using it, I congratulate and wish them only to achieve every possible purpose or exemplary achievement.

To make BL non systemd, I see ther's no point to make another non-systemd distro. It requires a great deal of energy or resources of people available.
Everybody who use it, enjoy the BL cake as it is imo!

My primary distro now is FreeBSD, I'm still new to this system or BSD-derivates, but I'm glad I took the first steps on BSD.


OS: FreeBSD & Devuan ~ WM: CWM & Fluxbox
Nothing beats peace and quiet - Tomoki Sakurai

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#880 2020-02-23 07:32:02

Colonel Panic
Member
Registered: 2018-11-13
Posts: 163

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

Sometimes I feel like I'm the least qualified person on this forum to comment on technical matters where Linux is concerned, but despite that I'd like to say that for me the jury's still out on systemd; I use distros both with it (such as Bunsen) and without it (such as Slackware and Devuan). I think it's good that alternatives still exist for those who want them.

I recently installed ExGent, a Swedish distro based on Gentoo, and am learning a bit about Gentoo as a result. It doesn't have as big a repository as Debian has (I couldn't find a way to install Osmo, for example) and compiling a package such as Thunderbird or LibreOffice takes literally hours, but once it's all up and running it seems to be trouble free.

Last edited by Colonel Panic (2020-02-23 09:48:37)

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#881 2020-02-24 07:27:45

ohnonot
...again
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 4,310
Website

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

Colonel Panic wrote:

I'd like to say that for me the jury's still out on systemd; I use distros both with it (such as Bunsen) and without it (such as Slackware and Devuan). I think it's good that alternatives still exist for those who want them.

Totally agree.
I happened to start using ArchLinux I think 2 years after they switched to systemd (which they did in 2012, only Fedora before that!). So, early adopters.
At that time I was blissfully unaware of such topics, but in retrospect I can say if you want to try a distro that uses systemd, and uses it well, try Archlinux. Or Fedora or CentOS.

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#882 2020-02-24 07:44:14

johnraff
nullglob
From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 6,383
Website

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

ohnonot wrote:

if you want to try a distro that uses systemd, and uses it well, try Archlinux. Or Fedora or CentOS.

Genuinely interested, not trolling, why do you not include Debian in that group?


...elevator in the Brain Hotel, broken down but just as well...
( a boring Japan blog (currently paused), idle Twitterings and GitStuff )

Introduction to the Bunsenlabs Lithium Desktop

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#883 2020-02-24 08:00:22

ohnonot
...again
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 4,310
Website

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

johnraff wrote:

Genuinely interested, not trolling, why do you not include Debian in that group?

Question of how much time they had to get familiar with & integrate it.
See the link I provided.
Also AL's philosophy of getting rid of cruft & sticking to what upstream provides, there's a natural interest to replace more and more things with systemd solutions.

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#884 2020-02-24 08:40:45

johnraff
nullglob
From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 6,383
Website

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

^Thanks. That fits Arch's image I guess, while in Debian the discussion (at least it's no longer a flame war) still goes on...

...but of course Debian users are still free to pursue systemd solutions as they wish. I'm not sure if late adoption necessarily meant less familiarity on the part of developers. Debian are late adopting anything, on principle I think, just as Arch's principle is the exact opposite.

Last edited by johnraff (2020-02-24 08:43:19)


...elevator in the Brain Hotel, broken down but just as well...
( a boring Japan blog (currently paused), idle Twitterings and GitStuff )

Introduction to the Bunsenlabs Lithium Desktop

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#885 2020-02-24 09:40:30

Sun For Miles
Member
Registered: 2017-04-12
Posts: 182

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

johnraff wrote:

Debian are late adopting anything, on principle I think, just as Arch's principle is the exact opposite.

That is my understanding as well.

Arch is so bleeding edge that there is zero support for old versions (even security updates are not being backported), which is a mix of a rolling distro and bleeding edge trait. If you want a stable bleeding edge distro you have many options, for example Debian - Unstable branch. smile

In the end, it is just a question of what do people want from a distro, both long and short term.


Señor Chang, why do you teach Spanish?

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#886 2020-02-24 14:26:28

glittersloth
...always giving it to you straight
Registered: 2015-09-30
Posts: 980

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

ohnonot wrote:
johnraff wrote:
ohnonot wrote:

if you want to try a distro that uses systemd, and uses it well, try Archlinux. Or Fedora or CentOS.

Genuinely interested, not trolling, why do you not include Debian in that group?

Question of how much time they had to get familiar with & integrate it.

Wouldn't that also apply to CentOS then?
Sure, I know there are differences between how Red Hat and Debian do things - the former might, on occasion include something that's slightly less than rock stable in the hope of hardening it solid early on during the long release cycles of CentOS or RHEL, while the latter only ever takes stuff that has moss growing on it - but both generally aren't current by design.

Last edited by glittersloth (2020-02-24 14:28:16)

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#887 2020-02-26 07:49:34

ohnonot
...again
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 4,310
Website

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

Nobody seems to have clicked on the link I provided:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systemd#Adoption
It's all very simple really, look at these dates (added to repo/released as default):
Fedora November 2010 / May 2011
Archlinux January 2012 / October 2012
Centos April 2014 / April 2014
Debian April 2012 / April 2015

I'm not saying ArchLinux is superior or the only distro that "knows" systemd; all I said is "if you want to try a distro that uses systemd, and uses it well, try Archlinux." Not only because the ArchWiki has extremely detailed documentation on systemd, but also because other things don't get in the way so much.

Also, imo, ArchLinux is cutting edge (=sharp), not bleeding edge (=pain). There's a difference.
In my experience, pretty stable.

Over and out.

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#888 2020-02-26 14:58:54

ratcheer
Member
From: USA
Registered: 2015-10-05
Posts: 252

Re: Distro-hoppers anonymous

Sorry, I've been running Arch for years, so that didn't really pique my interest. But everything you say is correct.

Also, the term "bleeding edge" makes me cringe, even if used for a distro or software that is so far out there that it's painful. But, the term is so commonly used now that I guess I should stop worrying about it.

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