Do I really "need" Google

g33zr · 2016-11-28 20:56:44

I just bought an Asus Chromebook, which includes 100GB storage on GoogleDrive. It's only 2.2 lbs. and the deal (ca. $50 off the normal retail price) was too good to ignore. Hmmmm...have I just sold me soul to Google?

BLizgreat! · 2016-11-28 23:16:34

^OH NOES, the Goog has assimilated G33zr !!!

This does it, resistance is futile !!!

Vll!

You going to get around to posting a review of the things performance G33zr ?

Sector11 · 2016-11-29 00:45:41

OH NO!!!!! I've been assimilated!

I am Secborg11

Borgdroid_V_1080x1920.png, Borgdroid_H_1920x1080.png, and Borgdroid_1920x1920.png

g33zr · 2016-11-29 01:47:03

@BLwbg: The Chromebook should arrive the end of the week. I plan to be overseas sometime in 2017 and want something lighter than my aging System76 laptop to take with me. In the past, I relied on accessing friends' PCs when I wanted to receive and send e-mail and I dislike sending e-mail on my cell phone unless it's a short sentence or two. Like you, I've been known to babble.

But I'll review it soonest.

Head_on_a_Stick · 2016-11-29 07:38:27

I really like the Google Drive integration in Nautilus, does that make me a bad person?

I tarball $HOME and upload it there for backup but I keep forgetting to encrypt it...

martix · 2016-11-29 14:31:00

@HoaS Obviously not - more like a "having limited rights"-person regarding your data. This is what google terms say:

"When you upload or otherwise submit content to our Services, you give Google (and those we work with) a worldwide license to use, host, store, reproduce, modify, create derivative works (such as those resulting from translations, adaptations or other changes we make so that your content works better with our Services), communicate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display and distribute such content."

If someone does not feel like agreeing to this kind of practice, there are other services like Nextcloud, SpiderOak, Mega, etc. As always, freedom of choice.

BLizgreat! · 2016-11-29 15:47:55

@G33zr, thanks will be interesting to see your perception of the system.

@HOAS, yes that makes you evil, however not for taking advantage of free services provided by Google or other parties but because you run Openbsd and everybody knows bsd'ers are evil. Some of em even have a lil devil as the official mascot. Coincidence ? I think not, gnu/Linux = penguin's and what could be less evil than that ?!?!?

Edit:@Sector ... NOOOOOOooooooooo, the Goog got him too !?!?!?! Wth is going on !??!!?

Now for the ultimate way to ensure almost complete privacy and anonymity online. You'll need a few things, a) A server farm with minimum of at least a few dozen web-servers with terabytes and terabytes of storage space. Note you can substitute anything which has ridiculous amounts of storage too.

b) Access to any prog or means to mass download and mirror web contents. Guessing majority of site ripping tools and offline browsers capable of downloading and mirroring entire websites could work but aren't ideal for this.

c) Download and store the entire internet onto local storage ( bonus points if someone can configure it to periodically rsync changes.) Just a mere several 100's of terabytes of diskspace needed AND !?!?!

d) Config and set-up whatever equipment is needed to conveniently access these resources and WHAM. You now have a somewhat private copy of the internet to browser as you please and as a side bonus you won't have to pay for any ISP access anymore or very seldom because the entire internet will be in your garage.

Obviously being a dork, though is a somewhat interesting idea involved here. The entire interwebz is friggin vast amounts of data. Shrugs.

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2016-11-29 16:02:50)

BLizgreat! · 2016-11-29 17:37:19

More mostly pointless junk about da MIGHTY GOOG!

To tell the truth, would much rather see google in the drivers seat than say someone like M$/Apple. At least the basis of their mobile offerings are to a fair degree open source and will almost surely stay that way. Not only cause it benefits google itself either.

Think the people at google actually do respect and have appreciation for open source. The founders and no doubt most of the best and senior staff are probably diehard gnu/Nix users themselves. Every person I've personally known who was extremely tech literate shared that preference. Meaning gnu/Nix or some variant is their personal go to platform of choice.

Plus those same people at google HQ I don't doubt make me look like a tech retard by comparison and have probably forgotten more about the subject than I'll ever manage to learn, shrugs.

Nor do I fault them for integrating google apps into the commercial releases. They've still left people plenty of options to either opt out or customize Android. Which someone like M$ or Apple would never do. They haven't cemented Chrome browser nowhere near as deeply as say, m$ did with IE.

So really, imo I perceive google Inc as to a reasonable degree an open source ally, even supporter and people can/do have the option of installing a vanilla Android OS/ROM too. Without googleapps-etc. So if some major Corp is going to dominate mobile, would almost rather it be one like Goog. At least they're leaving much access for customization, options etc. More so than the others would ever allow.

Also a just for the record babble. Am sure Google does have some fairly massive data collection efforts underway but much of that is nowhere near imo, as insidious as many tinfoilers are making it out to be. They want to refine and strengthen their position, find out what the users of the world want and better or more convenient ways to provide those services to boost their revenues. Any corporation is going to do that.

Yep ... babble edit:
Also if someone is so paranoid that they won't use anything google, not apps, not search ... none of their services. Tunnels everywhere they go around the web. While some of the stuff or inter-agreements google has may catch these people up too. With or without those tinfoilers having any clue it's happening. End of the dy, in marketing terms, these people are mainly considered as having no/minimal real value to an organization like Google. Who's going to pay or spend a buncha time/effort into compiling lists of people you make a sales call to and they all scream YOU'RE THE DEVIL and hang-up the phone whenever ya call ?
Google's too dang smart for that imo. Edit: Dang it, though that likely doesn't stop Google or M$ ( or others) from cashing in on those tinfoilers. Mentioned stuff like buying out competitors, as long as there's a profit, corps will do it and/or the providers of those services working out a deal with Goog/other to get paid. So ironically these people employing such "alternatives" to get away from Google/M$-etc are still using them regardless. In whatever form/fashion.

While for folks who are taking extreme efforts to evade tracking, ensure their privacy, while still totally doable imo. Though imo, those people are more likely to draw govt(s) scrutiny as opposed to an organization like Google. Stuff like TOR, govt(s) want to know what's going on with things like this and it's mere childs play the number of ways they can and likely have long since compromised it. Like hanging a sign on the sucker saying, Super-secret ( all terrorists and govt subversives welcome). Yeah I'm sure they won't invest plenty of efforts into cracking that elephant in the room ( interwebz) like a fricken nut.

Guessing were more than successful already having done so long ago. Though yeah, don't doubt Google + others can be forced to cooperate in ways too. Often realistically and legally, they have no choice in the matter. Much less if the powers that be were to decide to play hardball. Even a corp reporting 20bil+ earnings per Yr can get ripped apart if they piss off the wrong entities. Sometimes Google has publicly challenged it though, at least making a public stink and show of resistance. Whereas several others just complied immediately w/o said stink. So again, makes me respect google's intelligence. Even if were just a public PR angle. Was a smart one for them to make.

Just expressing some yet more pretty much pointless babble views on Google, privacy etc blahblahblah. Vll!

PS, nother observation. Also think of the promotion gnu/Nix is getting from Android. People are going to see and hear, Android is based on Linux, the Linux kernel etc etc etc. Some of these people are going to think, Linux ? Wth is that ? Thusly leading them to do some googling about it and some of them are going to say, damn ... why didn't anyone tell me about this ? All these years I've spent fighting viruses with M$ or paying out the nose for Apple and this has been around for decades ?!?!?!?!

PS2, to end this babble on a positive note. How friggin cute are these critters ?!?!??!?!?!?

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2016-11-29 22:36:02)

ohnonot · 2016-11-30 06:57:45

since you asked (and I wouldn't have used the term"bad person" here otherwise):

HOAS, yes that makes you evil a bad person, however not for taking advantage of free services provided by Google or other parties but because you run Openbsd...

...and keep telling us how much more secure it is. There's an inconsistency there.
Like: "I have the finest burglar preventions on my windows and even walls, water- and drainpipes, but keep my front door unlocked at all times."

Last edited by ohnonot (2016-11-30 06:58:30)

Head_on_a_Stick · 2016-11-30 07:33:15

^ *shrugs* there's nothing important on my computer, I just don't like using operating systems that do things badly...

BLizgreat! · 2016-11-30 17:55:51

That one kinda sailed over my head a bit Hoas, you know am kidding about Openbsd or any other open-source Unix like OS/users being evil fellow nixer. Usually don't try to feed any rivalry or divide among any groups of people. However there is somewhat a tradition to be kept here. So occasionally will take a good natured poke at the subject of x vs y regardless.

Atm looking over the Openbsd install process and going to give-er a go myself. Jmo that any diehard gnu/Linux user which hasn't tried it first hand for themselves really doesn't have a solid basis for whatever opinions they express on that topic. Been meaning to try Bsd for quite awhile. Opting for Openbsd cause it's apparently found favor with you and that's a good enough endorsement for me to try that variety first.

Am sure like anything else the whole Bsd vs gnu/Linux thing that both have their pros/cons. Not so much making one better or worse than the other. Once someone's personal preferences enter the picture often all bets are off anyway.

Though to be totally honest about it. Am fairly well already convinced that I'll mostly stay with gnu/Linux, due to the amount of resources and larger efforts aimed at development assoc with it vs the Bsd's. When first investigating migrating to open source did evaluate Bsd's too and vaguely remember those were the findings. That gnu/Nix receives much greater efforts in terms of development. Size of the support community etc etc blah. Am still sure Bsd's are fully functional, full featured OS's, in production or personal usecases.

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2016-11-30 17:59:57)

g33zr · 2016-11-30 19:31:13

^Of course BSDs are functional. Isn't OSX based on Mach kernel which was based on BSD and then later based on FreeBSD? Does that make OSX bad or BSD good? 8o

Head_on_a_Stick · 2016-11-30 20:19:42

^ & ^^ All operating systems suck!

8o

EDIT:

Linux sucks differently every time a kernel is released.

Last edited by Head_on_a_Stick (2016-11-30 20:21:03)

g33zr · 2016-11-30 20:39:48

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

^ & ^^ All operating systems suck!
8o
EDIT:
Linux sucks differently every time a kernel is released.

+1 ]:D

BLizgreat! · 2016-11-30 20:44:14

^Dang per usual, seem to be babbling a thread towards off-topic, arghhh. Though you know I'll babble at the drop of a hat and have many tech opinions for sure.

Nah only OS's and OS manufacturer I personally consider "evil" is M$. Not going to go into a massive babble rant as to all the supporting facts and views I base that on though. Which hey, Google Inc has long since done many things that are anti-M$ or at least pro-Google. Such as financing to help Mozilla, when IE dominated the web. Mozilla still has some lucrative agreements with Google too. Though with Chrome taking so much over, those revenues are going to drop for them.

With Apple, at least people get what they pay for. Since it's based on Unix, a more secure/stable and likely feature rich user experience ootb. Though also not sure why many of those among their userbase, don't just opt for a pc and one of the Bsd's. Potentially less cost and more freedoms. Though from what I'd read Bsd's tend not to have nearly the hardware support. It's been awhile since looked into it though and am also sure many among the OSx crowd are pointy-clicker types. Just as in window$.

OT ( HA! ): Google tried to go their own way for awhile with Android, though likely found it too difficult or costly to do on their own (inhouse) and realized it was foolish to turn aside all the expertise assoc with the Nix kernel development/developers. So they shortly thereafter remerged the project w gnu/Linux.

Again, that's my view on one of the reasons why the open source dev model kicks all hades out of closed. If 2 heads are better than one, even if they're both highly skilled in their field. How about 25,000 heads, all of them poss fricken gifted or expert level in the field applied to the same proj(s) ? Plus many more hobbyists of whichever skill level, tons of alpha-beta testers among a user community of millions. Seen folks much more aware of such matters than me making comments about why closed source comes up short compared.

Though since it's all opensource, not like xyz-organization can't study and try to replicate how things work within closed source environments and products. Am sure they routinely do and long since have.

I mean Google Inc ( or others) could take open source ( or kernel contribs), shroud them to whatever degree in secrecy and try to do it themselves inhouse. Though they'd be cutting themselves off from massive amounts of open source resources doing so. Not to mention, without their participation with kernel.org and upstream. Development efforts that would benefit them would likely not be focused on or receive nearly as much attention otherwise.

Google could try to hire or contract those expert nixers to do some work for them too of course. Though bottomline imo, Google regardless of their real intentions, is way too dang smart to kill the open source geese, laying the golden eggs, shrugs.

So guessing Google, Android and Nix will walk hand n hand indefinitely. Yep more babble. Which will be to all open source and users advantage. Think Richard Stallman is a friggin genius. I may tongue in cheek make fun of the guy occasionally but have a ton of respect for him and his intellect.

He knew open source ( or free software) would never make it far, if people couldn't make money out of it and Corps or businesses couldn't either. So ingeniously incorporated clauses into the GPL allowing people to do so. Sell is as is, change it and sell it ... do whatever the hades you want and you can still profit.

Which of course is great, people who have a hobby, yeah ok ... they might spend time on something they like or enjoy but still have to make a living. Clearly that would take precedence over a hobby for many/most folks. Though way RMS and whoever else advised on it left the door open so that skilled and knowledgeable people could make a dang fine living or even get wealthy by dev'ing and applying free software.

Stroke of genius imo ... and though it's been decades in the making. Think his intentions and plans (seeds he/others planted long ago) related to free/open source software are finally coming to fruition. Attracting a wealthy and well resourced patron like Google Inc. Looks to me gnu/Linux and friends are finally getting M$/Apple on the ropes. Expecting and hoping to see they're market shares start evaporating and gnu/Linux and open source finally get it's due.

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2016-11-30 21:18:31)

Head_on_a_Stick · 2016-11-30 20:50:52

BLwillbegreat! wrote:

only OS's and OS manufacturer I personally consider "evil" is M$.

https://www.linuxfoundation.org/announc … n-platinum

]:D

@S11: sorry about this, I'll stop now :8

BLizgreat! · 2016-11-30 20:58:27

^Yeah I've seen that HOAS, though findings were they wanted to do so, exclusively to support one of their offerings. Not because they want to get truly friendly with open source. Would have to pull up some links about it and too lazy.

Sure they contribute to some degree but it's for their best interests. Also thinking both M$ and Apple will have to lower the walls somewhat and start making efforts to mimic open source proj(s). Not cause they prefer to but because they'll have to in order to compete.

With Android and Nix, so fricken customizable and app makers on both platforms shooting out applications and util's to do just about anything someone can imagine. Puts them in a precarious position among users/consumers. Also since oem's can pretty much get Android ( and add to it or configure it anyway they want.) without paying licensing fee's to M$ or Apple. Means cheaper and a wider selection of devices available to consumers. Many with better features, than the others are able to supply. Which also puts conventional proprietary providers on shaky ground. Money talks ...

As to M$ specifically, they can hold out for a long time, even if they were to totally lose desktop and mobile. They've got lucrative contracts with several big govt(s)/Corps etc etc and plenty of other revenue streams out there too. Bing/hooooo, Bing ( M$) pretty much powers Yahoo now. I call it Binghoo. The combined market share of the ad display network, PPC etc in many places doesn't hold a candle to Google's but the money they're making isn't nothing to sneeze at either, shrugs.

They won't have to go on welfare, likely ever. They've still got plenty of investments and tech efforts bringing in the bacon. Last I checked M$ reported like 90+ billion in earnings for 2015, if I remember correctly. How much of that came from personal computing licenses ? Dunno exactly but not the lions share of it for sure.

Edit: By way of example roughly 9bil of that comes from the US govt. So almost 10% of their earnings, give or take a few triffling 10's of millions. :P
A concerned citizen may ask, why the US govt is flushing 9 bil dollars a year down the toilet, when for most of their needs better software is available for free ? Not 100% but think that's just the US FEDERAL govt. Wouldn't include state govt(s). Peeps might want to ask their state officials, if they've ever heard of this miraculous thing called gnu/Linux or open source software.

Ha ! This is google related ( sorta) so am not off-topic. :)

Ahhhhh shut it biz, sighs. One more, M$ has long had plenty of freeware, that's capable of majorly extending and adding features to their otherwise mostly crappy OS's ootb. Long since used much of those freeware apps/utils to enable features M$ didn't supply stock. That do it better than native M$ tools. To me, have come to conclude they did in on purpose.
When outside parties are writing better software than the maker. Giving people capabilities and features that manufacturer doesn't/won't. Gotta ask yourself why ? If m$ truly wanted to make their OS's better and good. Why wouldn't they integrate such features. Some of which ( a lot) were standard on Nix forever.
But are available with optional paid upgrades or whatever from Window$. Babbled plenty of times before now, think it was done intentionally. Why make a great rock solid OS, when you can release a 1/2 arse OS and people are going to take/use it anyway ?
Plus doing so isn't in their best interests either. Why pay to upgrade to latest M$ crapware, when you're perfectly happy with what you've got. ie: Xp ... they dropped support. Still plenty of people refusing to give it up or move onto their "newer"/"better" window$ OS's. Which in my experience have only gotten steadily worse time after time. :D
Let's nobody even mention Vista's release and the chaos which ensued from that affair ... lol. Dang it now really hinging on off-topic, also sorry Sector.

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2016-11-30 22:47:21)

Sector11 · 2016-11-30 22:21:03

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

BLwillbegreat! wrote:
only OS's and OS manufacturer I personally consider "evil" is M$.
https://www.linuxfoundation.org/announc … n-platinum
]:D
@S11: sorry about this, I'll stop now :8

You serious! Some of the best reading I've had in a long time ... like you British would say: Keep Calm and Carry On!

I'm enjoying this .... and learning things.

I know:

Keep  Calm
    and
Babble On!

BLizgreat! · 2016-11-30 23:01:51

^Sector, you seem your normal nice self. Guess the Goog wasn't able to totally absorb you fellow nixer.

@Hoas ... thanks for the reference, went ahead and read it. Opinion hasn't changed though. Think/know m$ is doing it to cover their own butt and protect their own profits. Mentioned they really don't have a choice anymore. At least less and less.

Funny M$ rep public service announcement:
Greetings all you people out there in the open source development and user communities. We come in peace, we would like to help you as much as possible. Even though we may've done everything imaginable to keep all your efforts, hard work and whatever else invisible, non-supported on oem's hardware as much as we possibly could and worked very hard bribing as many people and politicians as we could (making backroom deals with oem's and others) to ensure nobody would ever hear about you.
We've also enjoyed studying the way open source works and trying to adopt it or replicate whatever we could from it, to make whichever proprietary things we actually wanted to work better ... work better for u$. Thank you so much for your openness, we didn't even have to reverse engineer your work. Was all right there for the taking/imitating.
However now that the cat is getting out of the bag and beyond our control. We'd like to be friends and let by gone's be by gone's. We hope to support and/or work closely with you, in whatever capacity can be mutually beneficial ( to us.)
So whatdosay open source, how about a hand shake or hug ? Let's not live in the past but move on to a bright future of cooperation and friendship. In which we're able to consolidate ( or adapt) as many of our holdings as possible to keep the profits rolling in.

They make the wrong moves and it's going to hit home for them eventually. Watching their stock drop and profits shrink to whatever extent. Never said M$ is stupid, nor do I think the tech or marketing people they have on staff are dumbies. Just as with Goog Inc, am sure there's many a person on M$'s payroll, who make me look retarded.

Fact have known some people who work for them and are by no means slouches. Also these people prefer gnu/Linux themselves, even complaining when M$ sends them home and makes them use xyz-M$ OS or program to work out the bugs ... but whatever.

When someone has 90bil dollars to spread around not really surprising they can afford to hire the best. M$ stupid, nope, everyone who works in any capacity for them evil = don't think so. M$ Corp ( the core people and more than a few who work for them) total scumbags and sleezeballs who should be put out of business or in jail for all the things they've done and do = My opinion ... absolutely.

Vll!

Last edited by BLizgreat! (2016-11-30 23:45:25)

Sector11 · 2016-11-30 23:20:48

^ HA! You should see me behind the scenes .. real ----wad! ( think Gumball )
But only because I engage mouth/fingers before brain at times.

I think the point boils down to this:

While we don't "need" Google, it's so ingrained into everything "computer-related" it's a pretty well given that we can't get away from them. So learn to live with it and make the best out of it!

... and so says Secdroid11

Example: The medical lab I use sends the results to me and my doctor via email. Their address somelab@gmail.com - so there you have it, Google has my medical results a few seconds before I do. Now they know my bloodtype and heart rate!

#81 2016-11-28 20:56:44

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#82 2016-11-28 23:16:34

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#83 2016-11-29 00:45:41

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#84 2016-11-29 01:47:03

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#85 2016-11-29 07:38:27

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#86 2016-11-29 14:31:00

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#87 2016-11-29 15:47:55

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#88 2016-11-29 17:37:19

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#89 2016-11-30 06:57:45

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#90 2016-11-30 07:33:15

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#91 2016-11-30 17:55:51

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#92 2016-11-30 19:31:13

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#93 2016-11-30 20:19:42

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#94 2016-11-30 20:39:48

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#95 2016-11-30 20:44:14

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#96 2016-11-30 20:50:52

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#97 2016-11-30 20:58:27

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#98 2016-11-30 22:21:03

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#99 2016-11-30 23:01:51

Re: Do I really "need" Google

#100 2016-11-30 23:20:48

Re: Do I really "need" Google

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