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#326 2016-11-11 00:57:53

KrunchTime
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Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 857

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

Snap wrote:

A good practice is doing simulations (-s or --simulate) and performing the big or critical dist-upgrades outside the X-server; the tty (killing the display manager to do it can be a mess sometimes) and better switching to init 3.

Forgot about the -s/--simulate switch.  To perform dist-upgrades outside of X-server, one will need to install ceni or similar as network-manager is not useable from the command line.

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#327 2016-11-11 02:51:11

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 5,721
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

KrunchTime wrote:

To perform dist-upgrades outside of X-server, one will need to install ceni or similar as network-manager is not useable from the command line.

I don't see this, to be honest. Apt-get operations work fine in a tty without any special network tools installed - the stock Debian setup is enough, with or without network-manager.


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#328 2016-11-11 07:49:31

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

KrunchTime wrote:

network-manager is not useable from the command line.

Yes it is:

https://access.redhat.com/documentation … nmcli.html

Of course, NetworkManager and ceni are both just bloat on a Debian system which uses ifupdown to control network connections.

https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkConfigur … _Interface

https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/HowToUse#Command_Line


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#329 2016-11-12 09:23:01

Snap
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Registered: 2015-10-02
Posts: 465

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

^ Of course they are. But ceni is a lovely bloat LOL.

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#330 2016-11-24 23:44:12

KrunchTime
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Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 857

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

Hold off dist-upgrading for awhile.  I just attempted to dist-upgrade a few minutes ago and received the following:

The following packages were automatically installed and are no longer required:
  exuberant-ctags geany-plugin-addons geany-plugin-autoclose
  geany-plugin-automark geany-plugin-codenav geany-plugin-ctags
  geany-plugin-debugger geany-plugin-defineformat geany-plugin-devhelp
  geany-plugin-doc geany-plugin-extrasel geany-plugin-gendoc
  geany-plugin-geniuspaste geany-plugin-git-changebar geany-plugin-insertnum
  geany-plugin-latex geany-plugin-lineoperations geany-plugin-lipsum
  geany-plugin-lua geany-plugin-macro geany-plugin-miniscript
  geany-plugin-multiterm geany-plugin-numberedbookmarks geany-plugin-overview
  geany-plugin-pairtaghighlighter geany-plugin-pg geany-plugin-pohelper
  geany-plugin-prettyprinter geany-plugin-prj geany-plugin-projectorganizer
  geany-plugin-sendmail geany-plugin-shiftcolumn geany-plugin-spellcheck
  geany-plugin-tableconvert geany-plugin-treebrowser
  geany-plugin-updatechecker geany-plugin-vc geany-plugin-webhelper
  geany-plugin-xmlsnippets intltool-debian libarchive-zip-perl libc-dev-bin
  libctpl2 libfile-stripnondeterminism-perl libgit2-24 libgtkspell0
  libhttp-parser2.1 libip6tc0 libiptc0 libxatracker2 libxfont2 libxvmc1
  linux-libc-dev po-debconf x11-apps x11-session-utils xbitmaps xfonts-100dpi
  xfonts-75dpi xfonts-base xfonts-scalable xinit xserver-common
  xserver-xorg-core
Use 'sudo apt autoremove' to remove them.
The following packages will be REMOVED:
  build-essential debhelper dh-autoreconf dh-make dh-strip-nondeterminism
  equivs g++ g++-6 geany-plugin-py geany-plugins gufw iptables libc6-dev
  libexpat1-dev libpython2.7-dev libstdc++-6-dev libtool ufw xorg xpra
  xserver-xorg xserver-xorg-input-all xserver-xorg-input-evdev
  xserver-xorg-input-libinput xserver-xorg-input-mouse
  xserver-xorg-input-synaptics xserver-xorg-input-vmmouse
  xserver-xorg-input-void xserver-xorg-input-wacom xserver-xorg-video-all
  xserver-xorg-video-amdgpu xserver-xorg-video-ati xserver-xorg-video-cirrus
  xserver-xorg-video-dummy xserver-xorg-video-fbdev xserver-xorg-video-intel
  xserver-xorg-video-mach64 xserver-xorg-video-mga xserver-xorg-video-neomagic
  xserver-xorg-video-nouveau xserver-xorg-video-qxl xserver-xorg-video-r128
  xserver-xorg-video-radeon xserver-xorg-video-savage
  xserver-xorg-video-sisusb xserver-xorg-video-tdfx xserver-xorg-video-trident
  xserver-xorg-video-vesa xserver-xorg-video-vmware
The following NEW packages will be installed:
  libldap-common libxfont2
The following packages have been kept back:
  libc6 libc6-dbg
The following packages will be upgraded:
  binutils clamtk console-setup console-setup-linux cpp devscripts dirmngr
  fonts-lyx gcc gir1.2-gtk-3.0 gnupg gnupg-agent gnupg-l10n gnupg2 gpa gpgsm
  gpgv gstreamer1.0-plugins-good gstreamer1.0-pulseaudio gtk-update-icon-cache
  imagemagick imagemagick-6-common imagemagick-6.q16 keyboard-configuration
  libbcmail-java libbcpkix-java libbcprov-java libc-bin libc-dev-bin libc-l10n
  libcgi-fast-perl libdebconfclient0 libedit2 libedit2:i386 libgcj-bc
  libgcj-common libglib2.0-0 libglib2.0-data libgpgme11 libgtk-3-0
  libgtk-3-bin libgtk-3-common libhtml-parser-perl libip4tc0 libip6tc0
  libiptc0 libldap-2.4-2 libldap-2.4-2:i386 liblockfile-bin liblockfile1
  libmagickcore-6.q16-2 libmagickcore-6.q16-2-extra libmagickwand-6.q16-2
  libmwaw-0.3-3 libparams-validationcompiler-perl libpath-tiny-perl libprocps6
  libpython2.7 libpython2.7-minimal libpython2.7-stdlib libpython3.5
  libpython3.5-minimal libpython3.5-stdlib libruby2.3 libshine3 libshine3:i386
  libssl1.1 libustr-1.0-1 libvlc-bin libvlc5 libvlccore8 libxfont1 locales
  multiarch-support ntp ntpdate openssl procps python-xapian python2.7
  python2.7-minimal python3.5 python3.5-minimal rsyslog ruby-atk
  ruby-gdk-pixbuf2 ruby-gio2 ruby-glib2 ruby-gobject-introspection ruby-gtk2
  ruby-pango ruby2.3 scrot stunnel4 vivaldi-stable vlc vlc-bin vlc-data
  vlc-l10n vlc-plugin-base vlc-plugin-notify vlc-plugin-qt vlc-plugin-samba
  vlc-plugin-skins2 vlc-plugin-video-output vlc-plugin-video-splitter
  vlc-plugin-visualization vpnc x11-common xfonts-utils xserver-common
  xserver-xorg-core
112 upgraded, 2 newly installed, 49 to remove and 2 not upgraded.
Need to get 131 MB of archives.
After this operation, 116 MB disk space will be freed.

So I opted to cherry-pick and was able to install most of the upgrades.  Some upgrades would have resulted in other package removals, so I didn't upgrade those.  Rebooted and LightDM now will not start.

Some info on the Siduction forums:  https://forum.siduction.org/index.php?topic=6455.0

@johnraff:  I'll try again, but in the past whenever I wasn't able to startup in a GUI, I wasn't able to use apt.  Perhaps I'm not understanding something.

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#331 2016-11-25 06:23:54

KrunchTime
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Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 857

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

johnraff wrote:
KrunchTime wrote:

To perform dist-upgrades outside of X-server, one will need to install ceni or similar as network-manager is not useable from the command line.

I don't see this, to be honest. Apt-get operations work fine in a tty without any special network tools installed - the stock Debian setup is enough, with or without network-manager.

You are correct.  I was able to use apt on my desktop under tty1 where X-server is currently not starting.

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#332 2016-12-04 11:16:58

Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

Anybody running GNOME in testing should hold off upgrading for the moment, it looks like mutter may be b0rked:

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=130710


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#333 2016-12-04 21:29:55

pvsage
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Registered: 2015-09-29
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

Anyone else tracking Sid having trouble with h.264 videos freezing while sound continues?  My google-fu fails me in searching for relevant bug reports, but the problem is hitting me in mpv, vlc, and gnome-mplayer, so I'm pretty sure it's codec-related...


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#334 2016-12-06 09:54:00

KrunchTime
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Posts: 857

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

^ Don't know about gnome-player, but there have been recent updates to mpv and vlc.

Last edited by KrunchTime (2016-12-06 09:56:18)

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#335 2016-12-06 10:01:25

pvsage
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Posts: 1,433

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

^ Yeah, and I've been grabbing them on a daily basis.  Pretty sure the bug is in the gstreamer codecs though, since it's happening in all the players and, while VLC has its own internal codecs, I'm pretty sure it builds them against gstreamer.


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#336 2016-12-10 19:39:55

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

For those who are tracking stretch in preparation for the Debian 9.0 release and prefer a next-generation packet filter:

root@stretch:~# apt-listbugs list nftables
Retrieving bug reports... Done
Parsing Found/Fixed information... Done
serious bugs of nftables (→ ) <Resolved in some Version>
 b1 - #845413 - nftables linked against libxtables12 but depends on libxtables11 (Fixed: 0.6+snapshot20161117-2)
Summary:
 nftables(1 bug)

The nftables package in stretch is currently broken thanks to a dependency mismatch sad

For those who need their firewall up now, the necessary packages can be pulled from sid temporarily.

First, add sid:

# tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/sid.list <<< "deb http://httpredir.debian.org/debian sid main"

Then create a preferences file:

# tee /etc/apt/preferences.d/00nftables.pref <<!
Package: *
Pin: release a=unstable
Pin-Priority: 100
!

This assigns an APT pin value of 100 to all sid packages, this is the same as that used for stable backports and means that only targeted packages will be installed.

More details on this technique here:

https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debi … le_literal

Now the package database can be updated and the packages installed:

# apt update
# apt install -t sid nftables libxtables12

Once the packages are installed, remove the sid repositories & preferences file and update the database again:

# rm /etc/apt/{preferences.d/00nftables.pref,sources.list.d/sid.list}
# apt update

The nftables package can then be used as normal, I prefer the "workstation" preset:

# cp /usr/share/doc/nftables/examples/syntax/workstation /etc/nftables.conf
# systemctl enable nftables --now

smile


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#337 2016-12-10 19:58:10

stevep
MX Linux Developer
Registered: 2016-08-08
Posts: 373

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

pvsage wrote:

^ Yeah, and I've been grabbing them on a daily basis.  Pretty sure the bug is in the gstreamer codecs though, since it's happening in all the players and, while VLC has its own internal codecs, I'm pretty sure it builds them against gstreamer.

VLC has no gstreamer connections, instead it uses the ffmpeg libraries directly.

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#338 2016-12-25 00:02:27

KrunchTime
Member
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 857

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

Recent wpasupplicant upgrade may break wireless on some systems.  I saw this bug when I upgraded my laptop earlier today.  Unfortunately, my desktop was upgraded a day or two ago and I have verified the bug to be valid.  I'm unable to connect at all via a wireless connection.  Based on my setup and some of the bug report submissions, this may only affect Broadcom wireless cards.

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugrepo … bug=849077

Update:  Modifying /etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf per the above bug thread didn't work on my desktop.  I have a Broadcom BCM4352 WiFi card in my desktop.  Downgrading to wpasupplicant v2.5-2+v2.4-3+b1 (from Testing) did resolve the issue.

Last edited by KrunchTime (2016-12-29 00:27:01)

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#339 2017-04-13 14:08:21

hhh
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Registered: 2015-09-17
Posts: 8,312
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

I'm doing some forum cleanup today, this sticky needs attention. 14 pages is too long for a sticky, for one thing.

This topic has died down while stretch, and therefore sid, has been frozen but will go haywire when stretch is released and a flood of packages enter sid.

I'd like to create a new Sticky in the Development forum that gives a walkthrough for upgrading to testing and sid and tips for maintaining that system. The new sticky will have links to this thread "for more information", especially to a few posts that give specific instructions.

I'd also like to move this thread to Development as well, I think the subject and feedback are more fitting there.

Any objections or suggestions?

Thanks!

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#340 2017-04-13 14:21:48

damo
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Registered: 2015-08-20
Posts: 5,057

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

I think that for the regulars here who are tracking testing/unstable, continuous additions to the thread act as a useful "newsfeed" of possible problems, so unstickying it won't make much difference I guess. And "Development" seems a more natural home for the thread, as you suggest.


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#341 2017-04-13 14:42:11

hhh
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

Right, thanks for the confirmation, @damo. I was envisioning a walkthrough sticky and links to this thread for ongoing conversation.

I'll go ahead and unsticky this and move it to Development with a redirect link.

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#342 2017-04-16 10:37:35

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

hhh wrote:

I'd like to create a new Sticky in the Development forum that gives a walkthrough for upgrading to testing and sid and tips for maintaining that system.

[...]

Any objections or suggestions?

Can't we leave that sort of thing to the Siduction & LinuxBBQ folks?

They cover Debian's development branches really well and I think our focus should always be on the stable release.

I originally Stickied the testing/unstable thread to create a quasi-TNG zone for tracking Debian's development branches, apologies if this was the wrong thing to do.

EDIT: if people just want "BunsenLabs with newer packages", I would actually recommend ArchLabs over BunsidLabs:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/archlabs/

Last edited by Head_on_a_Stick (2017-04-16 14:06:10)


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#343 2017-04-17 08:53:36

johnraff
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From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2015-09-09
Posts: 5,721
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
hhh wrote:

I'd like to create a new Sticky in the Development forum that gives a walkthrough for upgrading to testing and sid and tips for maintaining that system.

[...]

Any objections or suggestions?

Can't we leave that sort of thing to the Siduction & LinuxBBQ folks?

They cover Debian's development branches really well and I think our focus should always be on the stable release.

Agreed that our focus here is on STABLE, but there is one context in which a BL discussion of upgrading to testing has relevance: preparing for Helium. Could there be a place for a short stickied how-to for people who want to help us sort out the potential problems by setting up an experimental Bunsen-like system on Stretch (not Sid)? (Maybe starting from the helium-dev netinstall script?) But that's not quite what @hhh was suggesting, perhaps: "...upgrading to testing and sid and tips for maintaining that system" does sound more like Siduction & LinuxBBQ.


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#344 2017-04-17 08:57:08

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

johnraff wrote:

preparing for Helium. Could there be a place for a short stickied how-to for people who want to help us sort out the potential problems by setting up an experimental Bunsen-like system on Stretch (not Sid)? (Maybe starting from the helium-dev netinstall script?)

Yes, that sounds like a great idea smile

I will try to cobble something together once I can get away from the Windows hardware that currently surrounds me and return to my UNIX enclave.


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#345 2017-04-17 09:33:34

johnraff
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

^Cool. Perhaps add a few hints on the sort of problems it would be helpful (to us) for people to check for?

Last edited by johnraff (2017-04-18 01:15:51)


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#346 2017-04-17 12:51:21

hhh
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Registered: 2015-09-17
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

johnraff wrote:

... what @hhh was suggesting, perhaps: "...upgrading to testing and sid and tips for maintaining that system" does sound more like Siduction & LinuxBBQ.

Agreed, since those forums are what I would have recommended as Tip #1. tongue Thanks for the good advice, gents.

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#347 2017-05-28 01:32:44

DeepDayze
Member
From: In Linux Land
Registered: 2017-05-28
Posts: 731

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

I am interested in this as I like using Sid as being on the edge is fun :-)

Thanks for this thread as there was a thread on the old #! forums on rebasing it to Sid and how to deal with issues that might come up when moving from stable base to Sid.


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#348 2017-05-29 17:24:20

DeepDayze
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From: In Linux Land
Registered: 2017-05-28
Posts: 731

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

Currently in doing a test update in the BL VM I created right now from stable to Sid the following get removed:

The following packages will be REMOVED:
  bunsen-meta-java bunsen-themes coinor-libcoinmp1 coinor-libcoinutils3 coinor-libosi1 firmware-adi firmware-ralink fonts-droid icedtea-7-plugin libasprintf0c2 libatkmm-1.6-1 libboost-date-time1.55.0
  libcairomm-1.0-1 libclucene-contribs1 libclucene-core1 libcmis-0.4-4 libcwidget3 libebml4 libglibmm-2.4-1c2a libgltf-0.0-0 libgtkmm-2.4-1c2a libgtkmm-3.0-1 libmatroska6 libobrender29 libobt2
  libopencv-calib3d2.4 libopencv-contrib2.4 libopencv-core2.4 libopencv-features2d2.4 libopencv-flann2.4 libopencv-highgui2.4 libopencv-imgproc2.4 libopencv-legacy2.4 libopencv-ml2.4 libopencv-objdetect2.4
  libopencv-video2.4 libpangomm-1.4-1 libperl5.20 libproxy1 libpython3.4 libpython3.4-minimal libpython3.4-stdlib libsidplay1 libsidplayfp3 libsigc++-2.0-0c2a libtag1-vanilla libtag1c2a
  libwebkitgtk-3.0-common libwxbase3.0-0 libwxgtk3.0-0 module-init-tools perl-modules pulseaudio-module-x11 python-cupshelpers python3.4 python3.4-minimal xserver-xorg-input-vmmouse
  xserver-xorg-video-modesetting

From this looks like the BL themes package and the BL Java metapackage gets removed. In looking thru the packages to be installed list many of them will be re-installed (new package names).

Anyone try going from stable Deuterium to Sid?


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#349 2017-05-29 17:45:41

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
Registered: 2015-09-29
Posts: 8,759
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Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

DeepDayze wrote:

Anyone try going from stable Deuterium to Sid?

Most of the people in this thread (but not me).

I would actually recommend ArchLabs over BunSidLabs, I think that it would be easier to maintain.

EDIT: the Deuterium point release is a relatively minor change, at least in respect of Debian dependencies and versioning, so the earlier experiences of those running Hydrogen should be (roughly) applicable.

Last edited by Head_on_a_Stick (2017-05-29 17:46:59)


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#350 2017-05-29 17:50:14

DeepDayze
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From: In Linux Land
Registered: 2017-05-28
Posts: 731

Re: Tracking Debian testing/unstable with BunsenLabs

I might try rebasing BL to testing as well to see how that will work. But with the imminent release of Stretch that might be a bit hairy.


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